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Post by Bloomers Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:26 am

Nibbles22 wrote:
anders wrote:Assumptions?? Are you kidding me??? She said right out of her own mouth when Bent was leaving her that she "saw the end, and he was there" - that she wanted it to be over tomorrow - has anyone forgotten episode 5 where she wouldn't shut up about Bentley?

I dont' know how anyone can think that MF created all the Bentley drama without the help of Ashley - we can't forget how she threw herself in bed and was 'broken hearted' and didn't know how she was going to carry on. He can splice and dice all he wants, but this show isn't animated he can't create something that was never there. He can certainly embellish it, and he did, but her fascination with Bent was real.
I agree with you Anders, in that her fascination for Bentley was real! For crying out loud we see the words
come right out of her mouth ~ and in the outfits she is wearing during current dates or rose ceremony
cocktail parties. TPTB then insert the comments about Bentley after a scene where Ashley seems to have
a good date or great connection, like with JP or Ben, Ames or Constantine... and it makes those moments
seem meaningless. It never ends!

RS also stated in his spoilers that Ashley knew full well that Bentley was in Hong Kong, because SHE
requested it! It's impossible to deny that this was all producer driven storyline, when Ashley herself gave
them so much to work with. With very few exceptions (like JP), you can tell that Ashley is emotionally
unavailable to the bachelors, and they know it, and sense it! no

Maybe - just maybe there is an argument for what Bentley says, or what Bentley maybe says, doesn't really say, supposedly says, spliced and diced says, "we didn't actually see Bentley say that at the time" says, etc. - but we are watching Ashley in time say what she says about Bentley, and this is after she has been loving on all of the guys including Ben, but especially JP who is supposed to be our hero who she has actually been falling in love with all this time.

We have to be realistic here no matter how much we like someone, and no matter we want to jump on his train and ride it into lah-lah land. He has a wonderful smile, but Ashley WAS saying those things about Bentley all along the way, and she is the one in episode 5 that wanted to be able to see Bentley again, but she couldn't quit thinking about BENTLEY and ...

The truth is that we will NEVER know whether Ashley would have gone with Bentley if he had given her the chance. He didn't, and we don't know. The edit leads us to believe there is every chance she would have. He was in the driver's seat and in charge with the ... She said she would be satisfied if he closed the book on the two of them. At this point, she could then move on.


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Post by gurlbrit Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:30 am

anders wrote:
nutty1 wrote:Why JP from moment one? Like a planned thing? Where did that theory come from?

To believe it was JP from moment one, then one must believe that all the Bentley stuff was a rouse. She clearly stated he was her one, not JP, not anyone else, it was supposed to be Bentley.

And if she comes out publically and says it was always JP - I call bullshit.

Senior moment, but did we actually see her say that he (Bentley) was going to be her F1, was it in an ITM where we actually see her say the words, or did we hear her say that she thought he was going to be there at the end. Semantics I know but being there at the end could mean he was going to be F2?

Not being snarky just trying to put all this stuff together in my mind. yes


I have decided to stick with love. Hate is too great a burden to bear. ~Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Post by ironcat Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:31 am

anders wrote:
ironcat wrote:
anders wrote:
ironcat wrote: Mickey's certainly entitled to feel that he has a legitimate beef with Ashley. However, as this isn't a contest where Ashley is officiating, the fact that getting angry at Ashley is his reaction to what happened is proof to me that he isn't falling in love with her, so it's just as well he leaves now.

The guys who truly care romantically for Ashley and don't view this as a sporting competition anymore are the ones who won't feel she disrespected them.


Wait a second here – Ashley is the one who’s been hung up on Bentley for 6 episodes – not Mickey. He’s entitled to his feelings and just because he’s angry about what Ash says (and frankly we don’t yet how she reveals this to the guys) – that hardly means that he never cared, it could be that he saw the writing on the wall and had nothing to do with ‘losing the competition’ – as far as I know, no one here has the means to know exactly what he was feeling when this happened.

Anders, we obviously feel very differently on this point. I said that Mickey is entitled to his feelings, but it is MY OPINION that if his reaction is being angry with Ashley (as opposed to being hurt/disappointed, which is how it appears, but we still don't know) it's indicative that he wasn't really falling for her, but it was more about (losing) the competition. I believe that when you really care deeply for a person, you would/should try more to empathize with their situation and put their feelings ahead of your own, which is what I believe JP will do. Again, JMO and you're certainly entitled to a different one.

of course we have no idea how this will play out on Monday - and we do know that no matter how it actually went down MF's editing tricks are going to tell the story he wants to tell/sell - I'd rather give all the players the benefit of the doubt before jumping to negative conclusions.

I'm MOST interested in the how's and why's Ashley brings up the whole thing - I think that may be at the cruxt of the reactions that come from the men. (Isn't that what CH already implied)

I agree, and I could be wrong, but I suspect CH did Ashley no favors by comparing the situation to having sex with an ex, which already puts an egregious image in our heads and makes it sound far worse than I bet it will be. After all, assuming that Ashley didn't have sex with Bentley (of course there is an article out there claiming she did, which I personally find ridiculous but some may not), at most she thought about him a lot while spending time with the others, which is certainly not a comparable offense. And then his use of the term "cocky" further makes it appear that Ashley was callous in her reveal, which, based on what we know of her, doesn't seem likely to me. So I will be curious to see if CH's description of events is accurate, or if it turns out to be just one more example of throwing Ashley under the bus to goose ratings.

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Post by anders Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:34 am

gurlbrit wrote:
anders wrote:
nutty1 wrote:Why JP from moment one? Like a planned thing? Where did that theory come from?

To believe it was JP from moment one, then one must believe that all the Bentley stuff was a rouse. She clearly stated he was her one, not JP, not anyone else, it was supposed to be Bentley.

And if she comes out publically and says it was always JP - I call bullshit.

Senior moment, but did we actually see her say that he (Bentley) was going to be her F1, was it in an ITM where we actually see her say the words, or did we hear her say that she thought he was going to be there at the end. Semantics I know but being there at the end could mean he was going to be F2?

Not being snarky just trying to put all this stuff together in my mind. Update on the *Possible* F1/F2 - Thread #2 - Page 39 3792326465

We saw her say it to Bentley when he was at her house saying good bye to her. I don't recall her exact words, but it was something along the lines of "I saw the end and I saw you there". It was not an ITM or a PI - it was to his face, and she also said other things, they talked about wishing the end was tomorrow. I'm not one to keep the episodes - someone may want to check the actual wording, if they feel the need.


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Post by northernviewer Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:35 am

I think we can discern from how Ashley fell for Bentley, that when she falls, she falls hard and that she is very "focused" :giggle: Night one, from what we could see from the edit, she was attracted to Bentley, JP, Ryan and I think William. I think it quickley faded with Ryan and William, it "flamed" and then subsided with Bentley.... but JP was the slow burn that was constant throughout filming. I think that even if Bentley would have stayed, she would have eventually went with JP anyway as I think that eventually Bentley's nastiness would have shown through and even she would have seen it. I don't think the other guys were ever even considered by her and I think the guys picked up on that. Many are assuming that the reason the guys are leaving is because they weren't attracted to her, but I think it's more like she never lead them on enough for them to get in to deep and become heartbroken, so to speak.


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Post by gurlbrit Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:37 am

anders wrote:
gurlbrit wrote:
anders wrote:
nutty1 wrote:Why JP from moment one? Like a planned thing? Where did that theory come from?

To believe it was JP from moment one, then one must believe that all the Bentley stuff was a rouse. She clearly stated he was her one, not JP, not anyone else, it was supposed to be Bentley.

And if she comes out publically and says it was always JP - I call bullshit.

Senior moment, but did we actually see her say that he (Bentley) was going to be her F1, was it in an ITM where we actually see her say the words, or did we hear her say that she thought he was going to be there at the end. Semantics I know but being there at the end could mean he was going to be F2?

Not being snarky just trying to put all this stuff together in my mind. Update on the *Possible* F1/F2 - Thread #2 - Page 39 3792326465

We saw her say it to Bentley when he was at her house saying good bye to her. I don't recall her exact words, but it was something along the lines of "I saw the end and I saw you there". It was not an ITM or a PI - it was to his face, and she also said other things, they talked about wishing the end was tomorrow. I'm not one to keep the episodes - someone may want to check the actual wording, if they feel the need.

Thanks Anders, I watch at the gym on Monday evenings and miss about 15 minutes of the show during the drive home, needless to say this was probably during my 15 minute drive home LOL.

This season is a mess and I thought Jilly's season was up there, but OMG this one is starting to take the cake.

:Spitoutdrink:
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Post by ironcat Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:43 am

Bloomers wrote:
Nibbles22 wrote:
anders wrote:Assumptions?? Are you kidding me??? She said right out of her own mouth when Bent was leaving her that she "saw the end, and he was there" - that she wanted it to be over tomorrow - has anyone forgotten episode 5 where she wouldn't shut up about Bentley?

I dont' know how anyone can think that MF created all the Bentley drama without the help of Ashley - we can't forget how she threw herself in bed and was 'broken hearted' and didn't know how she was going to carry on. He can splice and dice all he wants, but this show isn't animated he can't create something that was never there. He can certainly embellish it, and he did, but her fascination with Bent was real.
I agree with you Anders, in that her fascination for Bentley was real! For crying out loud we see the words
come right out of her mouth ~ and in the outfits she is wearing during current dates or rose ceremony
cocktail parties. TPTB then insert the comments about Bentley after a scene where Ashley seems to have
a good date or great connection, like with JP or Ben, Ames or Constantine... and it makes those moments
seem meaningless. It never ends!

RS also stated in his spoilers that Ashley knew full well that Bentley was in Hong Kong, because SHE
requested it! It's impossible to deny that this was all producer driven storyline, when Ashley herself gave
them so much to work with. With very few exceptions (like JP), you can tell that Ashley is emotionally
unavailable to the bachelors, and they know it, and sense it! no

Maybe - just maybe there is an argument for what Bentley says, or what Bentley maybe says, doesn't really say, supposedly says, spliced and diced says, "we didn't actually see Bentley say that at the time" says, etc. - but we are watching Ashley in time say what she says about Bentley, and this is after she has been loving on all of the guys including Ben, but especially JP who is supposed to be our hero who she has actually been falling in love with all this time.

We have to be realistic here no matter how much we like someone, and no matter we want to jump on his train and ride it into lah-lah land. He has a wonderful smile, but Ashley WAS saying those things about Bentley all along the way, and she is the one in episode 5 that wanted to be able to see Bentley again, but she couldn't quit thinking about BENTLEY and ...

The truth is that we will NEVER know whether Ashley would have gone with Bentley if he had given her the chance. He didn't, and we don't know. The edit leads us to believe there is every chance she would have. He was in the driver's seat and in charge with the ... She said she would be satisfied if he closed the book on the two of them. At this point, she could then move on.

We will never know, but I think that Ashley was basing her assumption that Bentley would be her F1 (and I do believe she meant it at that time) on what little she knew of him as of week 3, which was the Bentley character that he was playing in her presence, and not the real Bentley that didn't even like her. This fantasy Bentley is also the image that she carried with her in the weeks that he was gone until she saw him again. Had Bentley stayed, and somehow actually morphed into the guy that had been wooing her, I do believe she would have taken him to F1. However, that guy was a total illusion, and there was no way that Bentley would ever have kept the premise up until the end, nor do I believe that his family would have gone along with it, so it's likely at some point, reality would have all come crashing down on Ashley. There's a good chance that it might have ruined the whole season for her if he stayed until that point though.

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Post by noobsleuth Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:49 am

northernviewer wrote:I think we can discern from how Ashley fell for Bentley, that when she falls, she falls hard and that she is very "focused" :giggle: Night one, from what we could see from the edit, she was attracted to Bentley, JP, Ryan and I think William. I think it quickley faded with Ryan and William, it "flamed" and then subsided with Bentley.... but JP was the slow burn that was constant throughout filming. I think that even if Bentley would have stayed, she would have eventually went with JP anyway as I think that eventually Bentley's nastiness would have shown through and even she would have seen it. I don't think the other guys were ever even considered by her and I think the guys picked up on that. Many are assuming that the reason the guys are leaving is because they weren't attracted to her, but I think it's more like she never lead them on enough for them to get in to deep and become heartbroken, so to speak.

I agree... and when would have real life kicked in with picking Bentley? She came off so delusional. He has a daughter, he has an ex wife, I don't know what religion Ashley is but she drinks like a sailor so she's not a strict Mormon. I could never see her moving to Utah since all she wants is to be closer to her family. She would have regretted choosing him. I don't think she had any perspective when she was saying those things to Bentley or about Bentley. He was the forbidden fruit and that's all... IMO.
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Post by northernviewer Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:59 am

noobsleuth wrote:
northernviewer wrote:I think we can discern from how Ashley fell for Bentley, that when she falls, she falls hard and that she is very "focused" :giggle: Night one, from what we could see from the edit, she was attracted to Bentley, JP, Ryan and I think William. I think it quickley faded with Ryan and William, it "flamed" and then subsided with Bentley.... but JP was the slow burn that was constant throughout filming. I think that even if Bentley would have stayed, she would have eventually went with JP anyway as I think that eventually Bentley's nastiness would have shown through and even she would have seen it. I don't think the other guys were ever even considered by her and I think the guys picked up on that. Many are assuming that the reason the guys are leaving is because they weren't attracted to her, but I think it's more like she never lead them on enough for them to get in to deep and become heartbroken, so to speak.

I agree... and when would have real life kicked in with picking Bentley? She came off so delusional. He has a daughter, he has an ex wife, I don't know what religion Ashley is but she drinks like a sailor so she's not a strict Mormon. I could never see her moving to Utah since all she wants is to be closer to her family. She would have regretted choosing him. I don't think she had any perspective when she was saying those things to Bentley or about Bentley. He was the forbidden fruit and that's all... IMO.

the bolded tickled my funny bone. rotfl thinking of Bentley considering himself a "strict Mormon" after the way he acted.... we could call him a "strict Moron" though as that applies :laughingoutlou
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Post by anders Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:00 am

ironcat wrote:We will never know, but I think that Ashley was basing her assumption that Bentley would be her F1 (and I do believe she meant it at that time) on what little she knew of him as of week 3, which was the Bentley character that he was playing in her presence, and not the real Bentley that didn't even like her. This fantasy Bentley is also the image that she carried with her in the weeks that he was gone until she saw him again. Had Bentley stayed, and somehow actually morphed into the guy that had been wooing her, I do believe she would have taken him to F1. However, that guy was a total illusion, and there was no way that Bentley would ever have kept the premise up until the end, nor do I believe that his family would have gone along with it, so it's likely at some point, reality would have all come crashing down on Ashley. There's a good chance that it might have ruined the whole season for her if he stayed until that point though.

ICAM - she was so infatuated in who she imaged Bent to be that she just couldn't see him clearly in those 8 days. Given time, she would've picked up the cues that he was what others had warned her about. It took Jill a while to really see Wes for who he was. Had Bent stayed, I have faith she would've seen the real Bent.


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Post by Guest Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:02 am

gurlbrit wrote:
anders wrote:
nutty1 wrote:Why JP from moment one? Like a planned thing? Where did that theory come from?

To believe it was JP from moment one, then one must believe that all the Bentley stuff was a rouse. She clearly stated he was her one, not JP, not anyone else, it was supposed to be Bentley.

And if she comes out publically and says it was always JP - I call bullshit.

Senior moment, but did we actually see her say that he (Bentley) was going to be her F1, was it in an ITM where we actually see her say the words, or did we hear her say that she thought he was going to be there at the end. Semantics I know but being there at the end could mean he was going to be F2?

Not being snarky just trying to put all this stuff together in my mind. yes

At that point that she made those statements about Bentley, didn't she not have any time SQT with JP? I know they kissed at the RC but he didn't have a date for the first 2 weeks while Bentley had the most time with her. Bentley and Ashley were already physical with each other so that probably added to her infatuation with him. I can definitely agree with Anders that Ashley can't say that it was JP from the beginning because we all heard her say he wasn't.

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Post by Bronwyn Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:02 am

anders wrote:Assumptions?? Are you kidding me??? She said right out of her own mouth when Bent was leaving her that she "saw the end, and he was there" - that she wanted it to be over tomorrow - has anyone forgotten episode 5 where she wouldn't shut up about Bentley?

I dont' know how anyone can think that MF created all the Bentley drama without the help of Ashley - we can't forget how she threw herself in bed and was 'broken hearted' and didn't know how she was going to carry on. He can splice and dice all he wants, but this show isn't animated he can't create something that was never there. He can certainly embellish it, and he did, but her fascination with Bent was real.

That throwing herself in bed scene just looked completely fake to me though. The whole time I was watching it when they were filming her from the back, there was no movement like there would be if someone was laying there sobbing. It looked like she was just laying there napping. If they finally hadn't shown her from the front wiping a tear or two, I would have thought that was exactly what she was doing. Taking a nap.

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