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Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by Max64 on Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:20 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
etherealfire wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:JPs comments were pretty much in line with what ChrisL said about it being a done deal and they can all go home now. Maybe a bit different wording but the exact same meaning. So yes, it was an absolute negative

I also nave found over the seasons that some things get a bit overlooked regarding the board favorite. Just wanted to point out that JP does have his moments and makes one think that just maybe he isn't getting that good ole F1 edit. As some call it - wonky

I totally see your point here, but the one thing I can't overlook at this point is the fact that we really and truly are not being shown anything remotely like real competition for Ashley's heart, including the ghost of DB Bentley, no matter how much they tried to spin it that way last night. I don't think it was you that specifically mentioned this, but whomever it was that pointed out that JP inferred that he had this in the bag... well in his defense, the edit has yet to show us anything to convince me (and I would suggest, the vast majority of viewers) that JP is incorrect in his assertions.

Personally, I adore Ben F, Ryan P and Constantine as much as I do JP - I think they are, each in their own way, stellar guys! But only two of those guy (to me at least) seem even remotely interested in being the last man standing, ring in hand; and that is Ryan P and JP. Of those two guys, only one is being edited to show Ashley returning that interest. Things may change up in the next few weeks (and they are going to have to change up in a very big way to make any sense at all, to me anyway), but as it stands right now, JP really and truly appears to have no viable competition, as far as the editing goes, IMO, anyway.

I fully agree with your entire post except that I do believe that as of this episode, Bentley is equal if not more a competition than JP. But of course as you said, its his ghost and it remains to be seen how Ashley deals with this.

The other point to note which I agree with you is the second bolded. Perhaps a bolt of lightening strikes her or some similar earth shattering event occurs. But this is needed for her to flip totally for JP too IMO after this whole Bentley drama.


Ashley has made the comment that she felt "maybe" some of her relationships have surpased what she had with Bentley. I think that her lightening bolt will be she's going to have a great time on her date with JP, see Bentley and realize she's moved on. And after seeing him she'll realize that she was just fixated on something that wasn't there.

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by JBF on Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:03 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Armchair psychology (just because we can)....

Ashley is being presented as a mess -- insecure, erratic, impulsive, obsessive, and walled off emotionally. She does not seem to be having any fun except in a scripted manner (saying what's socially expected about what is romantic, amazing, etc.).

Frankly? She seems to be a younger, female Brad Womack.... with the classic "daddy issues" exhibited by girls who were abandoned by fathers too young -- i.e., being impulsively/compulsively drawn to abusive inappropriate mates. Brad/Ashely's first date at the amusement park "clicked" for them because they could so deeply relate to the shared pain of a father who walked off the job.

As Ben F was describing his terrific father last night, I read (perhaps projected?!) the pain on her face that she DIDN'T have that. You don't see her transitioning to what a terrific mate Ben would make for HER because he had that. She does not seem to have done adequate processing of her own grief/anger/loss and until she is, she isn't ready to "pick" yet.

One could fantasize that the emotional roller coaster / "journey" of filming this dumb show is the equivalent of therapy, but that's not real. Half the dang season has passed, and she is not going to work it out in the next three weeks of filming.

It's funny, when watching that scene last night between Ben and Ashley and the father discussion, I remembered Brad and Chantal and thinking how much Brad needed Chantal's dad in his life. Ashley could use a dad like Ben's in her life, but you're right. She's not ready.

Gotta say I don't really understand why you say Ashley is "not ready"? She is trying to decide how interested she is in Ben, not his father (who btw, since he is sadly deceased, wouldn't be in her life in the flesh even if she chose Ben). I can certainly understand her feeling some personal pain/loss at hearing about anyone who had/has a wonderful relationship with their dad, since she never had that. But I don't see that reaction as evidence that she is running away from Ben because of it, anymore than it should be a reason that she should pursue him because of it. For all we know, many of the other guys have wonderful dads as well.

The Ben F moment is telling because I have received the magical power of being able to read the mind of reality TV characters from the safe perch of my Tempurpedic bed by staring at a very large Flat screen TV. This stuff just comes to me. [tongue in cheek emoticon]

I'm probably in the minority here, but I think the deceased daddy story is being gassed up like the Bentley. They are trying to drum up star appeal for Benny, as a potential B candidate. (The editing of Ryan is getting too muddled and confusing, but Ben is getting the perfect work-out here.) Also, unless we are getting a repeat of the JED situation, there isn't enough "heat" in his relationship with Ash. They are trying to resurrect a touch of Roberto, Mister Private & Guarded Final One, to help make him a viable candidate for final 2. Needless to say, the editors were really struggling here to put him on near-equal footing with JP... now, THOSE scenes with Ashley often involve more out-of-focus "oopsies" and editing lop & chop than usual so viewers can't see her practically crying. (Yes, that blur we saw in the last show was intentional.) They also made sure three guys, including JP, all commented on her "chemistry" with him and have her dressing in short-shorts like she was going to do "the JP" on Ben.

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by Guest on Tue Jun 21, 2011 6:05 pm

@nd4reality wrote:

I fully agree with your entire post except that I do believe that as of this episode, Bentley is equal if not more a competition than JP. But of course as you said, its his ghost and it remains to be seen how Ashley deals with this.

The other point to note which I agree with you is the second bolded. Perhaps a bolt of lightening strikes her or some similar earth shattering event occurs. But this is needed for her to flip totally for JP too IMO after this whole Bentley drama.

And knowing TPTB, that may very well happen - didn't Fleiss mention a shocking RC coming up at the end of this whole thing? I was hoping it was major hyperbole but I almost shudder to think what may still lie ahead of us. :Frown: But then again, as long as we have a happy ending, I think I can deal with it. I like the last F5 so much, the only thing that would ruin this ending for me is DB Bentley at the FRC. And that couldn't possibly happen.... right??? :puke:

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by nd4reality on Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:55 pm

etherealfire wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:JPs comments were pretty much in line with what ChrisL said about it being a done deal and they can all go home now. Maybe a bit different wording but the exact same meaning. So yes, it was an absolute negative

I also nave found over the seasons that some things get a bit overlooked regarding the board favorite. Just wanted to point out that JP does have his moments and makes one think that just maybe he isn't getting that good ole F1 edit. As some call it - wonky

I totally see your point here, but the one thing I can't overlook at this point is the fact that we really and truly are not being shown anything remotely like real competition for Ashley's heart, including the ghost of DB Bentley, no matter how much they tried to spin it that way last night. I don't think it was you that specifically mentioned this, but whomever it was that pointed out that JP inferred that he had this in the bag... well in his defense, the edit has yet to show us anything to convince me (and I would suggest, the vast majority of viewers) that JP is incorrect in his assertions.

Personally, I adore Ben F, Ryan P and Constantine as much as I do JP - I think they are, each in their own way, stellar guys! But only two of those guy (to me at least) seem even remotely interested in being the last man standing, ring in hand; and that is Ryan P and JP. Of those two guys, only one is being edited to show Ashley returning that interest. Things may change up in the next few weeks (and they are going to have to change up in a very big way to make any sense at all, to me anyway), but as it stands right now, JP really and truly appears to have no viable competition, as far as the editing goes, IMO, anyway.

I fully agree with your entire post except that I do believe that as of this episode, Bentley is equal if not more a competition than JP. But of course as you said, its his ghost and it remains to be seen how Ashley deals with this.

The other point to note which I agree with you is the second bolded. Perhaps a bolt of lightening strikes her or some similar earth shattering event occurs. But this is needed for her to flip totally for JP too IMO after this whole Bentley drama.

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by Guest on Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:52 pm

@Starshine_16 wrote:
@KareyR2 wrote:I am probably the only one here with sympathy and understanding for Ashley in the whole "Bentley" thing. She was raised in a very small town, where they were so trusting, they had an "honour system" at their vegetable stand!!!! Remember how blown away Brad was by that, and how he wanted to live there. I was raised like that, with a Father who made deals on machinery for hundreds of thousands of dollars on a handshake, with never once a bad outcome. That was how I was raised, and I was conned by a international conman and left homeless, penniless, and car less!!! But that's my story on Dateline NBC!!!

It happens.....Ashley had no clue what Bentley was saying behind her back, and when did CH ever even try to clue her in. I never heard CH say anything like you need to hear what he is telling us Ashley, behind your back..."he is calling you an ugly duckling...he is wanting Emily here!!!"....yadda, yadda. Show her the fricking tapes.

While everryone here is pretty much coming down on Ashley, TPTB kept the truth of him, and her ultimate humiliation, from her. They can say they warned her..... I call BS on that. They had plenty of chances to even put a little bug in her ear, and none of that happened. I am sickened and saddened that someone raised, so trusting as Ashley, was played by not only Bentley the A$$....but also TPTB. She was just not raised equipped with that level of evil!!! It is not in her being. It is not a fair fight!!! JMHO
Loving JP for Ashley and Ames for me
Thanks
Karey :yes:

I agree word

Add me to this list. I honestly think a great many of us might look a little "moronic" (cringing at that assessment, to be honest) in the same situation. And I don't believe for a minute that TPTB would pass up the chance to edit this in the worst possible way. Jerks hissyfit

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by Guest on Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:47 pm

@Jeepers wrote:JPs comments were pretty much in line with what ChrisL said about it being a done deal and they can all go home now. Maybe a bit different wording but the exact same meaning. So yes, it was an absolute negative

I also nave found over the seasons that some things get a bit overlooked regarding the board favorite. Just wanted to point out that JP does have his moments and makes one think that just maybe he isn't getting that good ole F1 edit. As some call it - wonky

I totally see your point here, but the one thing I can't overlook at this point is the fact that we really and truly are not being shown anything remotely like real competition for Ashley's heart, including the ghost of DB Bentley, no matter how much they tried to spin it that way last night. I don't think it was you that specifically mentioned this, but whomever it was that pointed out that JP inferred that he had this in the bag... well in his defense, the edit has yet to show us anything to convince me (and I would suggest, the vast majority of viewers) that JP is incorrect in his assertions.

Personally, I adore Ben F, Ryan P and Constantine as much as I do JP - I think they are, each in their own way, stellar guys! But only two of those guy (to me at least) seem even remotely interested in being the last man standing, ring in hand; and that is Ryan P and JP. Of those two guys, only one is being edited to show Ashley returning that interest. Things may change up in the next few weeks (and they are going to have to change up in a very big way to make any sense at all, to me anyway), but as it stands right now, JP really and truly appears to have no viable competition, as far as the editing goes, IMO, anyway.

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by mnmhughes on Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:34 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:

Admittedly maybe I'm just seeing what I want to see but to me I think she was preoccupied in that chat with JP cause she sees that he is developing strong feelings for her and I think she is developing stronger feelings for him too. I think she realized that out of respect for him (or any other potential guys on the show) and a relationship that develops that she has to put the dot.dot.dot business behind her for good. I think she said as much to CH in the deliberation.

I agree


I agree too. That's it, in a nutshell. TPTB are over-dramatizing it for ratings. Otherwise the season would have been pretty boring and uneventful. I think we're not giving Ashley enough credit. She's trying to do the right thing and end this Bentley thing in her mind, so she feels free to fully give herself to others (JP). That moment when she was sitting on JP's lap was pivotal.

What struck me as odd was they just seemed to walk up to the seat and JP sat down and Ashley plopped herself down on his lap as if she'd been doing the same thing for years. :shock:

She seemed so comfortable about it, too. And it didn't look like he patted his lap or suggested it to her, so it was her idea. Definitely a level of comfort there.

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by gurlbrit on Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:32 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:

Admittedly maybe I'm just seeing what I want to see but to me I think she was preoccupied in that chat with JP cause she sees that he is developing strong feelings for her and I think she is developing stronger feelings for him too. I think she realized that out of respect for him (or any other potential guys on the show) and a relationship that develops that she has to put the dot.dot.dot business behind her for good. I think she said as much to CH in the deliberation.

I agree


I agree too. That's it, in a nutshell. TPTB are over-dramatizing it for ratings. Otherwise the season would have been pretty boring and uneventful. I think we're not giving Ashley enough credit. She's trying to do the right thing and end this Bentley thing in her mind, so she feels free to fully give herself to others (JP). That moment when she was sitting on JP's lap was pivotal.

What struck me as odd was they just seemed to walk up to the seat and JP sat down and Ashley plopped herself down on his lap as if she'd been doing the same thing for years. :shock:

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by chicagoowl on Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:29 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:

Admittedly maybe I'm just seeing what I want to see but to me I think she was preoccupied in that chat with JP cause she sees that he is developing strong feelings for her and I think she is developing stronger feelings for him too. I think she realized that out of respect for him (or any other potential guys on the show) and a relationship that develops that she has to put the dot.dot.dot business behind her for good. I think she said as much to CH in the deliberation.

I agree


I agree too. That's it, in a nutshell. TPTB are over-dramatizing it for ratings. Otherwise the season would have been pretty boring and uneventful. I think we're not giving Ashley enough credit. She's trying to do the right thing and end this Bentley thing in her mind, so she feels free to fully give herself to others (JP). That moment when she was sitting on JP's lap was pivotal.

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by moonchild on Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:21 pm

Did it bother anyone else that Ryan P didn't seem very remorseful that he gave Ames a concussion? I would be beside myself if I had done that!

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by bluwavz on Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:46 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Lucas already had his group date rose, and leaves next epi.

I'd forgotten about that. You're right. She wouldn't have been able to eliminate him.

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

Post by anders on Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:45 pm

Lucas already had his 1:1 date rose, and leaves the very next epi.


Last edited by anders on Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:46 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Episode 5 - 6/20 - Discussion - Spoilers

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