F1, F2, F3, and F4 Speculation - Spoilers - Discussion

ryvetted wrote:
What if she gave them an ultimatum prior to the FRC because she couldn't decide between them and let them decide for her (like Mickey). One came through and the other one couldn't.. hence "she had no choice" as in "JP made the choice."

Fijiman could be a crock so I can't make up my mind either as to who is F1 despite Ben's tweets. Its a tough one, because strictly based on Ashley's entire transformation when he's around, Ben's got what she wants. He's special out of the bunch and the producers saw that and purposely gave him those longer dates possibly.

On the other hand, she's a goner for JP. Just gone. He's everything she could ever ask for as far as I can tell!!

Dilemma indeed!

ryvetted wrote:Its a tough one, because strictly based on Ashley's entire transformation when he's around, Ben's got what she wants. He's special out of the bunch and the producers saw that and purposely gave him those longer dates possibly.

On the other hand, she's a goner for JP. Just gone. He's everything she could ever ask for as far as I can tell!!

Dilemma indeed!

Lucas15 wrote:

JBF wrote:I am not "expecting" it since it hasn't happened before... but IF it happens, I will NOT be surprised.

For much the same reasons you detailed - sorted out before I read yours, I have to put myself in the same boat.

For the record, Fleiss appears to have taken a commercial flight to Fiji on May 9:

fleissmeister Mike Fleiss
Guess who's on my flight????
9 May

Neil Lane was on his flight - he later posted a picture of Neil.

and 2 days later tweeted:

fleissmeister Mike Fleiss
Just shot the finale... OMG!!!!
11 May

Though we have never seen a finale that includes a wedding Fleiss has made it clear that this is his idea of the perfect show ending. We have never seen it because we have yet to get a couple that is so foolish - or confident in what they have - to get married.

ryvetted wrote:

CHO wrote:Call me crazy but .... I still have some conflicts.
JP and Ashley only had 2 evening only dates. This just doesn't sit well with me !!! I know they could have a longer time behind the scenes but I think we would have been able to view them. I am struck with the way Ben and A are when they are together. Ben tells her he likes where this is heading - she says me too. She tells him there is something he should know about her - and then the very natural and fun talking about how they talk with their dogs.
Why does Ben need to know this - if he is not her F1? I know the doubters are going to say - scripted - or whatever.

Fijiman says - she had no other choice but to pick JP.

Could it be that Ben comes early and excuses himself. JP comes and she rejects him but they walk out together (to fool any outside onlookers) - and there is more to come for the ending.

I know this is absolutely crazy - I can accept JP - although I am not personally ecstatic about her choice. But several things just don't add up. If A was so crazy about JP - why was she so beside herself when Bentley left ? OK maybe it was blown out of proportion by tptb - and certainly more drama was created when Bentley is asked to come back. But she told us very clearly that she had no one at that point. So how does JP suddenly change his status in her eyes. She hasn't told us that she has come to realize something different about JP. So I cannot understand her change of heart. I can understand that she might not have noticed Ben - if he was taking it slow - and then after Bentley leaves - Ben comes to the forefront when she sees him at the orphanage. Ben asks her if she likes him now - and she says maybe ...
Their first 1on1 was very normal and fun and romantic. Now she is going to have Ben for a date well into the night -- is this all really to make JP jealous and test his reactions? Just seems odd....
I know the date with Ben is going to test all of our reasoning skills. I am just not buying that the whole show was given to us on a silver platter. Remember Ashly likes surprises...

I realize JP only having evening dates could be to fool us - and the Bentley business could all be to divert our thoughts from just having JP as the clear contender and Ben's interractions with her are just to mix us up - they're just friends - she was never attracted to him in the first place etc. So I am expecting JP to be the F1 -- but I really feel in my heart that something is amiss !

What if she gave them an ultimatum prior to the FRC because she couldn't decide between them and let them decide for her (like Mickey). One came through and the other one couldn't.. hence "she had no choice" as in "JP made the choice."

Fijiman could be a crock so I can't make up my mind either as to who is F1 despite Ben's tweets. Its a tough one, because strictly based on Ashley's entire transformation when he's around, Ben's got what she wants. He's special out of the bunch and the producers saw that and purposely gave him those longer dates possibly.

On the other hand, she's a goner for JP. Just gone. He's everything she could ever ask for as far as I can tell!!

Dilemma indeed!

JBanana wrote:

ryvetted wrote:Its a tough one, because strictly based on Ashley's entire transformation when he's around, Ben's got what she wants. He's special out of the bunch and the producers saw that and purposely gave him those longer dates possibly.

On the other hand, she's a goner for JP. Just gone. He's everything she could ever ask for as far as I can tell!!

Dilemma indeed!

maybe that's what she's referring to in the VO about the struggle between what she thinks and what she feels?

Then again, she's said many times over the season, "no regrets," so I can't imagine her choosing "head" over "heart" at the end of this one.

kdubs_ca wrote:I think I've got it figured out... Fleiss' OMG? "OMG, I'm totally going to snow that kdubs chick in California again! Girl's almost 40 and I've been tricking her about the F1 since the time Alex didn't pick the girl who talked about the Big O on her fantasy date."

I remember a simpler time... The F2 was a mean girl like Kirsten or a dud like Matthew. All the signs pointed to who you didn't want to win so that when that first limo pulled up and THEY were inside you cheered and cheered. Now, it seems like they want the head scratcher, the whiskey-tango-foxtrot moment. Unfortunately, it's usually meant that the person who wins is the one who invokes a near gag reflex from me. What does that mean in this case? You heard it here first, the F1 is Bentley!

(Good news is.... I think my puke picker is broken. I was sure last year that it was Frank!) :Nod:

kdubs_ca wrote:I think I've got it figured out... Fleiss' OMG? "OMG, I'm totally going to snow that kdubs chick in California again! Girl's almost 40 and I've been tricking her about the F1 since the time Alex didn't pick the girl who talked about the Big O on her fantasy date."

I remember a simpler time... The F2 was a mean girl like Kirsten or a dud like Matthew. All the signs pointed to who you didn't want to win so that when that first limo pulled up and THEY were inside you cheered and cheered. Now, it seems like they want the head scratcher, the whiskey-tango-foxtrot moment. Unfortunately, it's usually meant that the person who wins is the one who invokes a near gag reflex from me. What does that mean in this case? You heard it here first, the F1 is Bentley!

(Good news is.... I think my puke picker is broken. I was sure last year that it was Frank!) :Nod:

JBF wrote:

Love_Me wrote:Remember when I asked Fiji guy if Ashley was engaged well I also asked him if their wedding would take place in Fiji and he answered yes. Even though the communication barrier has been a big problem etc. do you think there is a small chance a wedding did go down at the FRC? Would that have been leaked by now?

I bring this up because Blondie might be on to something with MF flying out all the way to see the FRC being filmed which is a rare thing for him to do.

I have never been able to shake this from the back of my mind... the possibility of Fleiss flying down to supervise a possible marriage.

Yes, it sounds so crazy! Yet I can't shake it off. No I am not "expecting" it since it hasn't happened before... but IF it happens, I will NOT be surprised. I think when I suggested it before, a couple comments were "Please NO! Not on this show." It is true that you can't marry until you get out of The Bubble and experience Real Life.

It first infiltrated my psyche when I discovered that one of Ashley's PIs during her date with William in Las Vegas, almost getting married, was revealed to be from Fiji, post-William. The subject of rush marriage was still on her mind at that late time-period.

Adding to this is the very strange editing this season. While so many here are fussing about "final one edits" and "final two edits", I am fussing over why so many quotes are being repeated over and over. For example: Mickey asking Ashley when the last time she cried, then Ash asking Jordan the same question. Then there are descriptions (the positive ones) about Bentley being repeated virtually word for word later in regards to Jordan. Then the engagement on the beach in Hong Kong and "who's next?" line. It all just feels like there is some kind of "surprise" at the end of this that keeps getting foreshadowed, just as Lucas' date foreshadowed Jordan's in several key lines in the last episode. Lots of stuff happening twice and always the second time involves Jordan.

IF... and ONLY IF this was the case, this would explain why Fleiss isn't terribly worried about Reality Steve or the leaks of an engagement, since it suggests that not all of his cards are on the table. I have the feeling this finale will ape some of the previous ones ratings-wise one way or another.

Again I repeat,

No I am not "expecting" it since it hasn't happened before... but IF it happens, I will NOT be surprised.

sjcaligurl wrote:

ryvetted wrote:

CHO wrote:Call me crazy but .... I still have some conflicts.
JP and Ashley only had 2 evening only dates. This just doesn't sit well with me !!! I know they could have a longer time behind the scenes but I think we would have been able to view them. I am struck with the way Ben and A are when they are together. Ben tells her he likes where this is heading - she says me too. She tells him there is something he should know about her - and then the very natural and fun talking about how they talk with their dogs.
Why does Ben need to know this - if he is not her F1? I know the doubters are going to say - scripted - or whatever.

Fijiman says - she had no other choice but to pick JP.

Could it be that Ben comes early and excuses himself. JP comes and she rejects him but they walk out together (to fool any outside onlookers) - and there is more to come for the ending.

I know this is absolutely crazy - I can accept JP - although I am not personally ecstatic about her choice. But several things just don't add up. If A was so crazy about JP - why was she so beside herself when Bentley left ? OK maybe it was blown out of proportion by tptb - and certainly more drama was created when Bentley is asked to come back. But she told us very clearly that she had no one at that point. So how does JP suddenly change his status in her eyes. She hasn't told us that she has come to realize something different about JP. So I cannot understand her change of heart. I can understand that she might not have noticed Ben - if he was taking it slow - and then after Bentley leaves - Ben comes to the forefront when she sees him at the orphanage. Ben asks her if she likes him now - and she says maybe ...
Their first 1on1 was very normal and fun and romantic. Now she is going to have Ben for a date well into the night -- is this all really to make JP jealous and test his reactions? Just seems odd....
I know the date with Ben is going to test all of our reasoning skills. I am just not buying that the whole show was given to us on a silver platter. Remember Ashly likes surprises...

I realize JP only having evening dates could be to fool us - and the Bentley business could all be to divert our thoughts from just having JP as the clear contender and Ben's interractions with her are just to mix us up - they're just friends - she was never attracted to him in the first place etc. So I am expecting JP to be the F1 -- but I really feel in my heart that something is amiss !

What if she gave them an ultimatum prior to the FRC because she couldn't decide between them and let them decide for her (like Mickey). One came through and the other one couldn't.. hence "she had no choice" as in "JP made the choice."

Fijiman could be a crock so I can't make up my mind either as to who is F1 despite Ben's tweets. Its a tough one, because strictly based on Ashley's entire transformation when he's around, Ben's got what she wants. He's special out of the bunch and the producers saw that and purposely gave him those longer dates possibly.

On the other hand, she's a goner for JP. Just gone. He's everything she could ever ask for as far as I can tell!!

Dilemma indeed!

I think she's a goner for JP too but for some reason she doesn't seem to grasp how strong his feelings are for her. When he made the comment about being on bended knee in a month, she questioned whether he really meant it. She did the same thing to him when she asked him "why" he would say "I'm not going anywhere" in the rain that night. He keeps looking at her like it should be obvious that he's serious. Is she dense?

She said she felt that Ben really liked her and that he felt like he'd been her boyfriend forever ... To date, they haven't shown her say that about JP. She seems to love being with him and totally worried about what he thinks of her but she's not trusting that he's going to really be there for her in the end despite how forward and honest he's been with her about how he sees them and how he wants things to be.

Is it going to take him really getting upset with her about the other guys next episode for her to get a clue? They are all over each other. They have real talks and seem like they are far more advanced in a relationship with each other moreso than the others. Her insecurities aren't really letting her see/believe that it's real w/JP (just like Ali was with Roberto). She's keeps doubting while he's going crazy.

It is odd that he's gotten two evening dates while most of the other guys have gotten full day dates but maybe that is because she feels she doesn't know them at all. Lucas got a dinner date too but his days are numbered.