Bachelor 21 - Nick Viall - Episode Discussion - **NO SPOILERS** - *SLEUTHING* DISCUSSION

JBF, I think that Danielle M. is a perfectly good guess for the woman who gets the final rose. She was one of my favorites right from the start. My worry is that she appears to have an innocent quality to her (which I find perfectly charming,) but I wonder if Nick has a more worldly woman in mind.

The reason I mentioned Raven as a dark horse is that a) she is gorgeous, and b) I think that Nick would like her entrepreneurial mindset. I also think she might be ready to break out of small town America. Time will tell.

Rachel seems level-headed with a very balanced personality that might appeal to Nick. She has experience and drive but also appears to be a very likeable woman.

If he goes for Corinne I will roll my eyes and enjoy the train wreck. But I hope he chooses better.

Hey! Any of these ladies can qualify. It was just how Danielle has been emphasized in these first episodes that has got me curious. I have the feeling she is not as innocent as she lets on.

With Rachel though, I am getting more of a F2 or F3 vibe. I guess because she is over emphasized in the promos.

I finally watched it over the past 2 days and it wasn't all that interesting to me. The first half was way too Corinne-centric imo. I'd have liked to see some of the other women and more of Danielle M's date. I liked a few of the women but I'd have liked to see someone tell Nick off for letting Corinne get away with so much plus giving her the rose. I certainly wasn't impressed by him or her. She seems like a spoiled brat, too used to getting her own way.

I liked Danielle M and think she could go far. I know that Nick seems to prefer brunettes but I always liked blondes yet married a brunette. I also liked Taylor who doesn't seem only 23 and the one who played Eve but didn't make a big deal of it. There are others but can't remember names at this stage.

The 2nd GD was better than the first although it was so uncomfortable with Liz & Nick. I agreed with his reasons for sending her home. It looks like there will be some fallout from that but I think they should be just as mad about how he is with Corinne imo.

My assessment of Corinne is that she is seriously lacking in self esteem. She covers this up with her aggressive sexuality and bravado. But IMO inside of her, there's nothing. She lives at home, she is employed in daddy's business, everything is provided for her on a silver platter. What has she ever accomplished on her own? To me, a woman who is sure of herself is not going to sell her sexuality like it's the only thing she's got to offer.

If you have no self esteem, try as hard as you might, you are not going to be capable of forming a healthy, lasting, intimate relationship.

That's why the date with Danielle M. was refreshing. She is a mature woman of achievement who knows that she has something to offer. Same for Vanessa, Rachel, and a number of other women on the cast.

What tickled me about Corrine in her intro clips was her "servant" bringing her cucumber slices and she suddenly chomping on them instead of using them over her eyes like Jordan and Robby did in JoJo's season.

JBF wrote:What tickled me about Corrine in her intro clips was her "servant" bringing her cucumber slices and she suddenly chomping on them instead of using them over her eyes like Jordan and Robby did in JoJo's season.

In the previews for tonight's episode, Corrine talks to some of the other girls about this woman. She calls the woman her "nanny." Apparently this servant does her laundry as well. Must be nice. The other girls were agog and even appalled.

I sure hope tonight's episode gives us more to talk about than Corrine.  There seem to be some really nice gals here for Nick to get to know.

After week two I was disappointed about not seeing Vanessa and Rachel, but guessing TPTB noticed the instant connections and are down playing them for a while and are instead focusing on the drama to get people's attention.

My favs are Vanessa, Danielle M, Brittany (what a good sport she was with the 1-piece suit), Rachel, and Sarah (I think she is still there).

I like Christen and Josephine but get the feeling they are in the friend zone.   I think several of these woman have a mature side, career goals/accomplishments and are very much here for the "right reasons".  However most are almost 10 years younger than Nick.  I am not sure that is a realistic age gap, especially when they are taken out of TV land and put into RL.

Happy Monday!  I look forward to everyone's recap and thoughts about tonight's episode  

I think that Christen and Josephine have been friend-zoned as well. Not everyone can be a contender. Nick probably wants to keep some women around with fun, pleasant personalities who can keep the house a happier and more harmonious place.

The women who've impressed me before continue to impress. I really liked Vanessa's one-on-one date. I like that Nick took care of her when she got sick (how real is that?) Their dinner date and conversation was wonderfully romantic. I also like that she is putting some demands on him with regard to Corinne. Vanessa is taking exactly the right tack that the problem is not Corinne's behavior, but Nick's response. What is it that he wants? It's a fair question.

Danielle L. is as cute as a button. She and Nick seem to converse easily, and they have good chemistry.

I like Dominique, and I'm sorry that she couldn't hang in there a bit longer. I agree with the women that Dominique gets in her head too much. Her strength is her beautiful smile and bubbly personality, and when she gets in her head, it interferes with that. I think she might be a good prospect for Paradise if she can try not to overthink things.

Rachel continues to do well. I continue to like Raven. I'm not so much a fan of Alexis nor Jaime, but each to her own.

Corinne is Corinne. I agree with Vanessa that Nick needs to do a more consistent job of managing her behavior in order to keep it in check.

The group dates were fun. I think the women did a good job dancing to the BSB. That was probably the one area where I found something in common with Corinne. I can't follow choreography for beans!

This episode put me to sleep. Maybe because Corrine was constantly sleeping between "performances". Needless-to-say, I see very little "heat" between her and Nick despite all of the whipped cream. I think she is just a nudist like Lucy the Free Spirit in Juan's season and a later Bachelor In Paradise. Most of what she does is just to shock the other ladies. Then she gets exhausted and takes a nap.

Nick also looked tired and droopy eyed except on Vanessa's date when he instantly started crying. That seemed to come out of nowhere.

Did anyone else see Nick grab Danielle L.'s azz? He's super attracted to her and that's the reason why she'll stay as long as she does.

Smitten isn't near the term to describe him around Vanessa. It's more than that.

I'm so over Corrinne and I don't enjoy Nick as the lead.

Agree, JBF, tonight was a snoozefest. For me, the F4 were cemented with tonight's episode...already the ladies most of us have identified in the past weeks.

Adding here my guesses both from the caps and edits -- (no particular order) Rachel, Danielle M, Danielle L and Vanessa. Vanessa ticked the box I've frequently heard Nick say was important to him. She will challenge him/stand up to him to make him a better person. Too early to say if she makes it to the end, but I think she goes far. I still think she may be the yacht girl...which makes her have a second 1-1 if I'm right.

This episode felt incredibly producer manipulated. I can't take much more of Corrine. From next week's preview, her drama will continue. We also have caps from the main preview that appears to show her on a 1-1 in a boat with Nick. Since we know, from other caps, the show goes to New Orleans, my guess is that date takes place in the Louisiana Bayou. My point is Corrine seems to be around for awhile. It's unfortunate because I can't stand her edited character. The producers are despicable.

Nick seems to be a very different person when he's on the 1-1 dates (both this week and last). This Nick I like. The GD Nick, not so much.