The Bachelorette 11 - Kaitlyn Bristowe - Epi 8 July 6th - *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

OnePromise wrote:It really makes me wonder how her journey would have been different if she had not engaged in sex at this early stage.  Would she still have chosen Shawn?  IMO her feelings for Nick became overshadowed by the pre-FS sex and she was never able to fully explore them after her fears about what Shawn would think about the situation dominated her thought process.  It likely was all that she thought about from that point on.  Does that mean that her fear about telling Shawn was her indicator that her relationship with him was the most important one?  Or could it have been that she was most fearful about telling him because he was so invested in her and she hated to think about hurting him?  IMO, this fear led her to push Nick out of her mind and not consider their relationship fully.  IMO, she sold herself (and Nick) short.

Interesting question.

IMO
She would still have been every bit as attracted to Shawn with or without Nick's presence because that attraction started the very first night - before Nick was on the show. Nick's presence was at best a diversion - something she felt a need to explore and she did.

IMO the pre-FS sex with Nick didn't draw her closer to Nick nor confuse her feelings with indecision or uncertainty - Nick? or Shawn? Instead all it did was cause her to realize she could lose Shawn because of what she had done. While she was concerned about the impact of sex with Nick she was only concerned how it could affect her relationship with Shawn; even though she sometimes said "the other guys" she also said "another guy" and specifically said the other guy was Shawn.

IMO she did give a relationship with Nick every chance she could have but very quickly determined that wasn't the relationship she wanted - the one she wanted was with Shawn and that was the relationship she spent the next weeks of filming fretting over and trying to figure out how to keep from losing it.

IMO Kaitlyn made two big mistakes that could be argued to be the dumbest things she did - or the best things she did. One was to tell Shawn he was the one. That was dumb because it gave Shawn a sense of entitlement (and IMO understandably so - try putting yourself in Shawn's shoes and think about how you would feel if someone told you "You're the one" and then turned around and chose to spend time with someone else that could have been spent with you and see how that feels). Dumb. But - it also showed Shawn that the light at the end of a tunnel wasn't a train coming in the opposite direction - it was a future with her which he wanted and had she not said that to him he would not have known - and might not have been as motivated to stay around when the going got tough - as it did.

The sex with Nick was dumb also. But because of it Kaitlyn was forced to make a choice - which relationship did she want - Nick? or Shawn? She would have been forced to make a choice later on anyway but instead was forced her to make her decision "now"; IMO the decision was inevitable - she had to explore the greater attraction. The sex with Nick also forced Shawn to deal with just how deep his feelings for Kaitlyn were - was she someone he could get mad at and walk away from because she had hurt him? Or was she someone that he wanted to be with so much that leaving Kaitlyn would hurt more than dealing with what she had done? Without the Nick sex he would never have been faced with that choice and it seems that he decided it would hurt less to deal with the issue than lose Kaitlyn.

IMO the one mistake gave Shawn motivation to stay and the other mistake forced both Kaitlyn and Shawn to make a choice about what was most important to each. They seem to have chosen each other. Sex with Nick made that the more difficult choice but also IMO increased their commitment to each other and made them stronger. Kaitlyn herself said this in an interview.
JMHO

Great post as usual, Lucas, and I agree with your assessment.
Question though....do we know for sure she had sex with Nick again in the fantasy suite? Because if so......then I don't get it. Even more so than I didn't get Andi doing it. K. was so afraid she was going to lose Shawn because she has sex with Nick. So why do it again??

nutty1 wrote:Great post as usual, Lucas, and I agree with your assessment.
Question though....do we know for sure she had sex with Nick again in the fantasy suite? Because if so......then I don't get it. Even more so than I didn't get Andi doing it. K. was so afraid she was going to lose Shawn because she has sex with Nick. So why do it again??

Well based on the us weekly article she did have sex again with nick in the FS according to an insider, which I don't get as well. And who is this insider? A producer?

nutty1 wrote:do we know for sure she had sex with Nick again in the fantasy suite?

mysthelma wrote:Well based on the us weekly article she did have sex again with nick in the FS according to an insider, which I don't get as well. And who is this insider? A producer?

I agree that this is a perplexing question and one that doesn't make sense if we look at it through the eyes of Kaitlyn - why in the world would she make the same "mistake" twice? The only way that makes sense is if you look at it through the eyes of the producers. IMO had Kaitlyn had sex with Nick in Dublin and not in the FS Nick would have known immediately that he was not her pick and wouldn't have proposed - he would have a very good reason to expect a rejection. I believe the producers wanted a proposal from Nick and knew it was going to be a rejection and they wanted that on film. It's not a good position to put Nick in but IMO they couldn't care less about that.

Exactly how they got Kaitlyn to have sex with Nick in the FS is something we'll probably never know. I suspect the timing of things played a role - it seems likely that she had the date with Nick before she told Shawn about the Dublin sex and not knowing what Shawn would do could have been used to get her to keep Nick "motivated" so she wouldn't end up with no one. But one thing that I do believe is that the producers are very very good at what they do which is to manipulate people into doing things on the show that they probably would not do in real life; IMO if we can figure out what it is they want - that's probably what we're going to see.

If they could convince someone to have sex with another, they are very very good! Or should I say very very bad??!

nutty1 wrote:Great post as usual, Lucas, and I agree with your assessment.
Question though....do we know for sure she had sex with Nick again in the fantasy suite? Because if so......then I don't get it. Even more so than I didn't get Andi doing it. K. was so afraid she was going to lose Shawn because she has sex with Nick. So why do it again??

Wonderful read, Lucas. And I'm with you nutty, sex with Nick a second time just doesn't seem right. Just like sex with Ben H. doesn't seem right.
Now, none of us know for sure if she sleeps with Nick a second time, it's just assumed. Reality Steve says she sleeps with all three guys, so that may be what people are going with.

chasingpavements wrote:It seems like most of the relationships in this franchise that last are leads that pick their F1 against what their usual type is. It also seems like most lasting relationships are based on a slow-burn, friendship that evolves into love (Sean/Cat, Des/Chris, Ashley/JP) and couples that fall in love on night one don't last (Brad/Emily, Ali/Roberto, Josh/Andi, etc).

I guess that's why I personally would have preferred Nick/Kaitlyn, although I honestly don't think that either relationship would have lasted more than a couple of months.

I've noticed that too and it makes sense. There are plenty of people who spend their twenties at least dating people who are all wrong for them, just because they have some visceral attraction to them. Then they wake up one morning 30 years old and still single and start giving other types a chance too because their clock is ticking. This show just speeds up that realization because the lead is presented with a variety of options and is forced to get to know people they might not even notice otherwise. Plus there's no guarantee that their early number one pick returns their feelings, like was the case with Brooks. But of course there are plenty of those who stubbornly fall for their usual type on night one and then can't even give anyone else a chance. I fear Kaitlyn may end up in that bracket. The only reason she gave Nick a chance is their preseason "friendship", which made her intrigued enough to want to find out more. But who knows, maybe her type is good for her and she's just been unlucky so far. I guess we'll see soon enough.

I also can't get behind the theory that Nick sex made her realize Shawn is The One and made her desperate to not lose him, if she indeed has sex with Nick again after telling Shawn about the first time. I'm afraid my rose-coloured glasses aren't tinted enough to see a perfect love story in this mess.

IMO- If Kaitlyn has sex with Nick a 2nd time in the FS then she was not truly concerned about losing Shawn or about his feelings. It is ridiculous to blame TPB.  Kaitlyn is a 30 yr old woman in charge of her own sexuality and choices on who and what she will share of herself.  I absolutely think she and Shawn are together and somehow he managed to deal with HER choices regarding sex with Nick.  Considering Shawn's insecurity with the process, I am amazed.

I can't see how a producer can force K to have sex again with Nick to get a proposal if she didn't want to. It's pretty obvious their chemistry was undeniable and she did like the sex and described it as perfect, something they both deserved. Clearly she wanted a second round. Either that or she really was coerced, and would explain the claims of cameras rolling in the FS. The producers wanted to make sure she followed through with the plan. These tptb are sick IMO. Are they going to show us sex with Nick again in the FS?

I am still wondering what the scandalous information about Shawn which Nick spills

isittrue wrote:I am still wondering what the scandalous information about Shawn which Nick spills

What do you mean? I was on vacation for 2 weeks and I am just catching up.

Regarding the breakups, this is like a callback to the Anna Karenina opener to me- all the couples that made it, made it for the same reason (both completely committed to making it work); all the ones who broke up, broke up for their own messed up reasons.

I don't even know if Shawn is her type, but she is crazily attracted to his type. Who knows how the endless number of faceless hockey players treated her?

Also, I don't think ash even had a serious bf before the show/JP, so they're in their category to me.

Regarding the second round of sex with Nick in the fs, I'm amazed too!!! Is it ever going to be brought up even? Will Shawn ask? Or will she be like, "I was too drunk the first time, so really needed to double and triple check, but you're definitely it, babe!" when she confesses to him finally?