The Bachelorette 11 - Kaitlyn Bristowe - FRC - ATFR- July 27th *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

timfan wrote:I do not feel sorry for nick he chose to go on the show and he became overconfident again that he was going to win the girl this time and put his family through it again and I wonder how he is going to embarrass Kaitlyn like he did andi but he will make it seem like oops I did not mean to say it or hurt Kaitlyn jmo

If the more trusted rag mags that get the insider scoop are to be believed, it's not hard to see where he would have felt confidence this time around.  Not getting into last time, didn't watch and IMO what did or didn't happen does not affect the relationship he formed with K.  Having sex multiple times all throughout filming, being told ILY by the lead, etc.  I could see where he would feel like he was indeed the F1 this time around.  That's not to say he shouldn't have still been worried.  He is on a show where TPTB that claim to be your friends try everything imaginable to manipulate you to get what they want.  And being it's his second time around, he should've been more aware that TPTB would definitely try to manipulate him even more to keep him truly unaware of his standings with Kaitlyn.  So yes, I feel sympathy for him, as I would any F2.  But I also think he's kind of dumb for putting himself back in this situation again and I'd feel that way about anyone returning.

jojo47 wrote:

bleuberry wrote:I just think TPTB would never entertain Nick AND Shawn not being at f2 together, after an entire season of the Nick and Shawn show.

This one sentence above sums up exactly why Nick is at the podium at F2. There is no way TPTB would allow any other two men in the F2 after all the manipulation & staging they were responsible for up to this point. At the FD stage, where suitors are typically separated, they had Shawn & Nick confronting each other for heavens sake. Allowing a different pairing at F2 or Nick being released early would be anticlimactic for the show. You can be sure they were having none of that.

So as much as Kaitlyn is responsible for how far she lets Nick get into a proposal, the producers are responsible for having Nick at the podium in the first place.

Production is not Nick's friend & he should never EVER forget that.

Awesome post jojo! Exactly, the whole season was set up around the final showdown between Nick and Shawn, and TPTB were determined to get it! Nick even fav'd a tweet about being one of the stars of the show, so he knows more than anyone that it was all about him and Shawn and less about K. K even joked about the guys forgetting about her amidst their feud at some points.

I agree with up thread, It's all us fans who defend and find excuses for our fave guy, Nick and Shawn never do that and I even applaud Shawn for being mostly quiet on sm.
I am curious, IF F2 is Shawn, Ben h, Jared, anyone but Nick the villain, would K fans still defend her and feel more sympathy towards the rejected one? I won't feel differently. I don't hate her, but question and disapprove many of her actions.

ITA with that. ^^  I don't dislike Kaitlyn, I dislike some of her actions.

Watching K at the men tell all threw me off the way she handled the guys that did not disagree with they way she carried herself. She does not handle criticism and differing opinion well and it's like she has to be right all the time. As humans we all have our weaknesses and faults and at some point we need to be self introspective and self critical of our actions and that hindsight we could do better. She could have said I let my feelings and being in the moment person cloud my judgement and certain decision and actions and that she was sorry for hurting their feelings, but she was having none of that. It pains me to say this she is worse than SWSNBN

This season really ratcheted up (or lowered the bar) on what one would normally consider confidence of being F1.
Without all the other little things involved and focusing only on quantifying the sex act itself, what would make one think the other person had more going into the FRC?
This goes beyond the normal self confidence/insecurities and kind of boggles the mind. All you can really come away with is :shocked!:

lexforlife wrote:Well, Nick was a wiling participant. He was one of the two consenting adults and from what I saw on my TV he was quite into it all and encouraged Kaitlyn's behavior (I can't even remember half of the cheesy lines he fed her to feed the so called "Kaitlyn behavior") . I'm still wondering or rather IMO, I feel since he attached so much importance to sex the last  time that he thought this early sex gave him an edge over the other contestants, too bad he forgot what show he was on.

I'm having a hard time figuring Nick out after 2 seasons where basically the same thing happens with, IMO, polar opposite women.  He seduces them, they feel some unexplainable adult passion they've never felt before, he makes them feel like a desired woman, they don't want to pursue a relationship with him.    

I hope Nick learns that seducing someone into bed is not the same as seducing them into love.  I don't know if he really is just a player spouting lines and actions he knows work and being as touchy feely as possible to get some action.  Or if he genuinely thinks physical seduction and sex is the way into a woman's heart?

If it's the latter and he actually wants to find someone to settle down with, which I think is probably true, I hope this repeat situation teaches him to slow the physical things down, build on the friendship and realize that turning someone on is a tiny piece of a very big puzzle of falling in love. I feel bad for the guy definitely and don't think Kaitlyn or the show were fair or kind to him.  It will be so sad to see him rejected.

The one I do notice that after the season, regardless of whether or not the lead has found love, they always say that they'd never do it again. I think the idea is more thrilling than the reality.

Relaxing, this is called being a playa playa and they fall because they are flattered at his attention imo. Yes, it's stupid.

relaxing wrote:

lexforlife wrote:Well, Nick was a wiling participant. He was one of the two consenting adults and from what I saw on my TV he was quite into it all and encouraged Kaitlyn's behavior (I can't even remember half of the cheesy lines he fed her to feed the so called "Kaitlyn behavior") . I'm still wondering or rather IMO, I feel since he attached so much importance to sex the last  time that he thought this early sex gave him an edge over the other contestants, too bad he forgot what show he was on.

I'm having a hard time figuring Nick out after 2 seasons where basically the same thing happens with, IMO, polar opposite women.  He seduces them, they feel some unexplainable adult passion they've never felt before, he makes them feel like a desired woman, they don't want to pursue a relationship with him.    

I hope Nick learns that seducing someone into bed is not the same as seducing them into love.  I don't know if he really is just a player spouting lines and actions he knows work and being as touchy feely as possible to get some action.  Or if he genuinely thinks physical seduction and sex is the way into a woman's heart?

If it's the latter and he actually wants to find someone to settle down with, which I think is probably true, I hope this repeat situation teaches him to slow the physical things down, build on the friendship and realize that turning someone on is a tiny piece of a very big puzzle of falling in love.  I feel bad for the guy definitely and don't think Kaitlyn or the show were fair or kind to him.  It will be so sad to see him rejected.

I don't know - I don't feel like he's "seducing" them, which seems very 1-sided to me. I remember making Andi making a lot of the first moves and Kaitlyn DEFINITELY made some of the first moves. I don't feel like he emphasizes the physical part of a relationship any more than past contestants have done. In fact, when talking about how much he likes Kaitlyn, he usually brings up the fact that she makes him laugh and brings out his goofy side. Just because he got the lust edit, doesn't mean that he only emphasizes the physical aspect of a relationship.

Also, I'm pretty sure that Nick has had a lot of casual sex in his life (from what I've heard) so I don't think that he finds sex to be the way to a woman's heart since he is capable of having sex without feelings. I think that his passion and intensity is just part of the reason that Andi and Kaitlyn were drawn to him, although he's not the best looking guy in the room or their usual type. It doesn't meant that was the ONLY appeal, though.

I don't understand, but correct me if I am wiring, didn't K put on that top so he could touch her? Didn't she invite him to stay? Who seduced whom? At least, I think both were equally seductive.

isittrue wrote:The one I do notice that after the season, regardless of whether or not the lead has found love, they always say that they'd never do it again.  I think the idea is more thrilling than the reality.  

Brad actually said he would love to do it again, when he talked to RS about it after his first season. Jillian also said she would do it again in a heartbeat if she were single. I do think it's a very physically and emotionally exhausting process, so immediately after, they probably are all like "we're going to be with F1 FOREVER! We'll never go through something like that again!'. And, then, inevitably when their F1 dumps them and they aren't getting as much attention on SM as they want...they're like "um, we'll do it! We'll do any crap you offer!".