Andi Dorfman & Josh Murray - Bachelorette 10 - General Discussion #2

I notice josh hasn't changed his picture with Andi for his advocate sight. She's still there with his arms aroud her.

mamahamme wrote:I notice josh hasn't changed his picture with Andi for his advocate sight. She's still there with his arms aroud her.

I know Josh has been busy with Advocare this weekend. But I am glad they are deleting things too fast. This shows me that they are not rushing to completely break it off. Or one is waiting to see what the other one is going to do. If they completely take their pictures off that will break my heart.

mamahamme wrote:Its sad that Andi was born and raised in Atlanta, josh moved to Atlanta a yr ago and yet it feels she is the one who is being punished not him. It just feels weird.

The Murrays are Georgia royalty. Atlanta is huge urban sprawl, so she could be from one part of ATL, but not know most of it and she left ATL and GA for both her undergrad and her law school. So less of a tie there in many minds. Though, I think she will have her defenders as well.

Diana wrote:I only saw the proposal but how can a girl doubt that?

The proposal read as false to me, just OTT and not real.

In retrospect, the doubts Andi expressed about Josh throughout the season (whether she could trust him/their connection/how perfect it all seemed) now clearly seem like a smokescreen for her deeper concerns....

Andi had everything she said wanted with Josh but her gut was telling her something wasn’t right, so she kept questioning it. But her hesitations couldn’t uncover the truth because the pull towards her dream was so strong. And I’ve had this experience in my life too where I was pulled towards a life choice and felt a great hesitation, but went for it anyway. Hindsight is always 20/20 and as painful as a mistake can be, sometimes you actually have to experience the wrong choice to get beyond it.

I feel for Andi. She tried so hard to make it work, and in the process turned her life upside down (she gave up her job, turned toward celebrity) to convince herself that it could work. But she could not overcome the fact that it wasn’t right.

And of course, I feel for Josh too, since I don’t believe he had any dilemma about the fantasy Andi sold him about what their life would be…

SueSt wrote:

Diana wrote:I only saw the proposal but how can a girl doubt that?

The proposal read as false to me, just OTT and not real.

I agree. She may be from Georgia, but she doesn't always sound like Vivien Leigh in Gone with the Wind. It just felt like she was putting on an act rather than speaking from her heart.

I don't understand what the Murrays being "Georgia Royalty" has anything to do with anything. Is Josh going to use his Georgia Royalty status to mess with her somehow? Tell the Waffle House to screw up her omelette order? Encourage the bouncers at the Ivy to deny her and the girls access? If every time a couple broke up and one of them had to move somewhere, we'd have a lot more colonies on the moon by now.

As for Andi doubting Josh and the relationship, clearly her woman's intuition was right on the money, otherwise they wouldn't have lasted a hot second after the show. Josh is a great guy and I'm sure he was being genuine when he said all those things about her, but he had no idea what he was saying imo, and Andi was right to doubt and doubt and doubt in retrospect.

Why was Andi right to doubt him and his sincerity? What evidence do we have that he has not lived up to everything he said on the show? He was and is pretty clear on what he's looking for and that hasn't changed post show neither has his personality or priorities changed. Maybe the image that Andi presented on the show wasn't a true reflection on who she is in reality. Because IMO, Andi got to know Josh a lot more than he got to know her so she knew what she was getting into Josh didn't have such a clear insight. I believe when in the HTD if Josh hadn't gotten the nod from him family he never would have gone further with the show. I personally think that Andi is the one who changed, she wanted to be such a good Bachelorette that somewhere along the lines she lost herself in the process and became more "plastic" than real, IMO. I still believe that Josh and Andi would have had lasting love if Hollywood was not in the equation. Sometimes fame just changes people, and in this case I think for the worse.

I have said this before and I will say it again. These 2 really love each other and everything seemed fine for the first 4 months when they were home more. Then the traveling started getting more frequent. They were always packing, unpacking and flying somewhere and flying back the next day or mostly taking the red eye. The stress of that alone would be hard on anyone. I truly think that took a toll on the relationship. Maybe with that coming to a halt and the smoke clears they may see what went wrong they may realize its things that can be worked on. Time apart will make things a lot clearer to them and they may just want to patch try and get back what they had at the beginning.

aviej wrote:Why was Andi right to doubt him and his sincerity? What evidence do we have that he has not lived up to everything he said on the show? He was and is pretty clear on what he's looking for and that hasn't changed post show neither has his personality or priorities changed. Maybe the image that Andi presented on the show wasn't a true reflection on who she is in reality. Because IMO, Andi got to know Josh a lot more than he got to know her so she knew what she was getting into Josh didn't have such a clear insight. I believe when in the HTD if Josh hadn't gotten the nod from him family he never would have gone further with the show. I personally think that Andi is the one who changed, she wanted to be such a good Bachelorette that somewhere along the lines she lost herself in the process and became more "plastic" than real, IMO. I still believe that Josh and Andi would have had lasting love if Hollywood was not in the equation. Sometimes fame just changes people, and in this case I think for the worse.

I agree aviej, The Josh we saw on the show seems to be the same Josh we see now. He was ready to get married and start a family. I think in the beginning Andi wanted it also. But for some reason it looked like she was pushing that back some. Which is fine if they both wanted that. Maybe this will make Andi see what's really important and realize it was Josh and a family all along. If she is truly not ready for that then Josh is the wrong man for her because he is truly ready for that and told her that all along. Josh just wants a normal life and family. He not after fame.

I've been wondering (I've clearly spent too much time on these two) if perharps it just came down to them not having that "cerebral connection" that Sharleen was talking about. Now I know they've said they're like best friends and I don't doubt that they could be, but there's a difference between having fun with someone/being able to chitchat about anything and actually being able to relate to the other person on the deepest possible level. Friendship doesn't require that, a lifetime together yes. At least it does to me. I always wondered about the depth of their connection, because quite frankly the show didn't show that. They mostly showed her doubts about the whole thing and some giggles once she finally loosened up. She's clearly a chronic over-thinker and rather insecure whereas Josh is more like the happy positive type who'd rather leave things in God's hands. She chose him thinking he would balance out her personality and teach her how to stay positive and have fun, but as many can attest, you can't expect your lover to fix you. I've been there, dating someone I wish I could be more like, and in the end I always reverted back to being my flawed self. At that point it's better to be with someone who can relate to your flaws rather than someone who preferred you while you were trying to be someone else. Not saying Josh couldn't accept her flaws, but could he relate really? I'm sure in the first few months he did have a positive effect on her, because they were still in the bubble, but as time went on and the excitement passed, she reverted back to the old insecure over-thinking Andi. Perhaps he got a bit tired of pulling her out of her funk and she sensed he wasn't as supportive anymore, which in turn made her even more insecure and then it just got to the point where it wasn't making either of them happy.

I'm glad Andi didn't choose Nick, but thinking they'd be miserable together over-thinking everything... in hindsight maybe that's exactly what she needed. Someone who can relate. Nick seems pretty mature to me and I don't think his thinker tendencies are a bad thing when he's in a good place. Might've helped to expand Andi's thoughts as well instead of them just going around in circles.

Josh accepted Andi and all her flaws. He knew she was an over thinker. Andi also said that she could be her complete self with Josh, he saw her for who she is and still loved her. Someone like that is hard to find and doesn't come along every day.

What is a cerebral connection anyway? You don't hear people say I married someone with a cerebral connection. You always hear people say I married my best friend.

I have some similar thoughts, aviej.

Let's not forget that according to RS, Andi dated someone starting once she got back from filming Juan Pablo's season up until she left filming for the bachelorette. This guy just happened to be a very, very wealthy real estate person down in ATL. That's makes it two relationships she broke off to go on the two shows, so if we're going to talk about trust issues..

I think it's going to take a very special breed of man to make it last with Andi. Not anything wrong about that, but that's my opinion. No guy from the show was going to be it.