Bachelor 19 - Chris Soules - Episode 3 - *Spoilers & Sleuthing* - Discussion

JBF wrote:The "whining" DOES make sense on an alcoholic level. Note that Kaitlyn was pouring his "bourbon" (or was it Whitney's "gift"?), while Whitney diverted his attention from the vineyards to a wedding in progress. He was only allowed a little dry champagne before pulling their stunt... and he certainly guzzled it down the moment they left the limo.

Whitney gave him the drink.

AllAboutLove I couldn't agree with you more! Plus, he seems the type to cheat after things get stale.

JBF wrote:Just so you folks know, we are all just speculating here of all of the possibilities.

Again, I am OK with any outcome of this season.

yes, speculation it is. I am just going with my gut after sleuthing SM and watching the season unfold. The outcome won't matter one bit in my llfe, for sure. Just fun.
:crazy dance:

JBF wrote:The "whining" DOES make sense on an alcoholic level. Note that Kaitlyn was pouring his "bourbon" (or was it Whitney's "gift"?), while Whitney diverted his attention from the vineyards to a wedding in progress. He was only allowed a little dry champagne before pulling their stunt... and he certainly guzzled it down the moment they left the limo.

That is even a bigger dig at Chris if it is taken literally. Chris certainly likes his liquor and his record proves that. Yes, a long time ago, but honestly, as much as Chris has been painted as the sincere farmer by TPTB he has been mocked in many ways, imo, with his cornfield montage (Field of Dreams not so much, imo), being slapped by CH - literally (even if for fun, still...) and then lots of liquor and gave second chance to Tara because as he stated in his first blog that he is no "choir boy" (or something to that effect .... I took it to mean he understood because he has had his drunk times too. Good on him).

Whitney did give him that whiskey? so a message from TPTB to have fun but WITHOUT the wine/liquor. Given what their date entailed (looking spontaneous) this was obviously VERY important. :Nod:

So, taken literally, the date card with "No whining" is basically the equivalent of a cautionary message from TPTB to "stay sober and focused" because you have this non-spontaneous wedding to crash that you NEED to make look spontaneous not only when crashing the wedding but before that.... to the point of Chris bringing up doing something/being spontaneous and then, lo and behold, Whitney finds them something spontaneous to do and the cameras and camera crew make sure to make it seem so spontaneous.

And that, imo, is why Chris looked nervous in the limo. He wanted to make sure he acted spontaneous knowing it wasn't.

I think you hit a significant bullseye here. However, I do not want to start a looooooooong discussion here that will stretch pages.

To make it short and sweet: it is no secret that Chris had (and could potentially still have)... some problems. This may be why Fleiss & Co. allowed that decade old DUI report leaked online (along with other minor "brushes") so that the contestants are aware that his past is not "perfect". 

This now adds clarity to a couple of puzzle pieces I was fussing over earlier:
1.) His giving Tara a second chance and why there was so much focus on her drinking. (Similar incident: Ashley Hebert allegedly, not certain of the details, had a troubled father-relationship and they made a point of her taking care of drunken Tim on her first night.)
2.) His comment to Kimmel that "the family" wasn't too happy he kept "the drunk one".
3.) Whitney shown giving him the whiskey and...
4.) Kaitlyn shown pouring his drink... a sign that a woman is monitoring him.

At this point, I feel this will be an Either Kaitlyn Or Whitney season and... until I see more of Becca and others on screen... I am mostly comparing and contrasting Chris with these two ladies first. (Call me silly. But I still think Fleiss can... and WILL again at some point... give us another "gotcha" ending. I would also not rule out more than one contestant involved with The Deception if... there is any deception involved.)

I don't know if Whitney was pulling our leg about Chris' dance moves... "the shopping cart" and "the lawn mower" LOL!... but I do enjoy watching her on screen and trying to determine whether or not she is winking at me in her PI sessions. Or Kaitlyn winking herself. She is another one I am still trying to figure out.

Finally watched this weeks episode.

First off Chris is a horrible conversationalist. Not sure if it's because he is nervous or is out of his element or is just not good at it, at times it's clear he is definitely inebriated but others he just looks awkward and downright flustered.

I am in agreement I think so far he looks the most at ease with Kaitlyn and Whitney. I really liked Becca last week in how she responded to Jeulias confession about her husband, so while I think she is a sweet and classy girl I just don't think she is a good match for Chris. This is of course based on what we have see this far. I just think Chris needs someone overly outgoing or bubbly to bring him out of his awkward she'll and she seems a little reserved for Chris.

My favourite parts of the episode were when Chris and Kaitlyn were genuinely laughing before Jimmy got to the eving portion. And I loved when Whitney and Chris were dancing at the wedding and afterwards. He to me was completely enamoured with Whitney after their date even though he could not even close express in words his face said it all to me.

I do think he is genuine though in this process I just don't think he is a good lead.

I apologize for my grammar and spelling above I am typing on my phone!!

^^^^ Made sense to me! Thanks for posting!

My only issue about the supposed wedding crash is where were the zebras? Saddlerock Ranch has 'em... Wait... More issues...That whole thing was set up, sure...you don't just happen into the bride's sisters in that crowd. And you don't go to a random place and just happen upon a wedding. And that you're close enough to the mansion to go back and change. And that they happened to have wedding wrapping paper for a gawdawful gift in a house nobody lives in... Ok, bsck to work.

To me, the instagram notes from the bride confirm she had a heads up. And perhaps her family members, and it spread mostly virally.

It would be far more consistent with Bach production methods to play Whitney and Chris to 100% believe it was a true crash, rather than the obvious ... i.e., due to legalities and the expense of filming an entire date that risked being unable to be aired if it was a true crash, of course that was worked out in advance to get clearance to do it. There would be damages etc. a couple or the venue could claim and seek under various scenarios, and they need permission to film on private property and permission to show anyone's name and likeness, etc. They wouldn't risk not having permission from the couple and the venue.

That said, I would actually not expect them to clue Chris and Whitney into that because the one thing you can bank on in this show is that the cast cannot act or fake it.

I think they dumped them into that reception, and they had the full adrenalin rush of how are we going to handle this together (the main glue of the format, after all, for bonding two strangers with cameras rolling). At some point over the evening, the whole party including them probably did figure it out.

All to say I think it was set up as an adrenalin date ... I don't think Chris or Whitney were "in on" to what extent the venue and the couple and entourage were prepared, on board, in the know, etc.

jlccaz..that is what I have said..you said it perfectly!

jlccaz wrote:To me, the instagram notes from the bride confirm she had a heads up.  And perhaps her family members, and it spread mostly virally.  

It would be far more consistent with Bach production methods to play Whitney and Chris to 100% believe it was a true crash, rather than the obvious ... i.e., due to legalities and the expense of filming an entire date that risked being unable to be aired if it was a true crash, of course that was worked out in advance to get clearance to do it.  There would be damages etc. a couple or the venue could claim and seek under various scenarios, and they need permission to film on private property and permission to show anyone's name and likeness, etc.  They wouldn't risk not having permission from the couple and the venue.

That said, I would actually not expect them to clue Chris and Whitney into that because the one thing you can bank on in this show is that the cast cannot act or fake it.

I think they dumped them into that reception, and they had the full adrenalin rush of how are we going to handle this together (the main glue of the format, after all, for bonding two strangers with cameras rolling).  At some point over the evening, the whole party including them probably did figure it out.

All to say I think it was set up as an adrenalin date ... I don't think Chris or Whitney were "in on" to what extent the venue and the couple and entourage were prepared, on board, in the know, etc.

This makes sense. I think Chris knew at least to a certain extent, since when Whitney asked if there were cameras he swallowed hard and said something about needing to be on the down low. I don't think he wanted to directly lie to her but knew he couldn't tell the truth