Re: Media Discussion - Bachelorette 7 - Thread #3

[emusha]

I think we all should brace ourselves regardless of what happens in HK bentleys name will be a part of this show till the end!

[ironcat]

It was a bad idea to tell the guys her little secret about The Bent One's return. She didn't have to. IF JP is her F1, and IF she's done with The Bent One and has moved on, and IF she told JP on his 1:1 date, and IF JP is cool with that -- why tell the other guys at all? IF all that's true they're all MOT guys anyway. So what if they see it on TV? It didn't affect their experience one way or the other if it was always only about JP and his opinion is the only one that matters.

Unless JP's opinion isn't the only one that matters.

You don't think TPTB had anything at all to do with this?

Considering that the guys' reaction to the news is obviously the key part of the episode (CH said as much) and what is being hyped, even moreso than Bentley's return, I think it's highly unlikely that it was totally Ashley's call whether or not to tell them. This is sounding more and more like manufactured drama, episode by episode. Wonder what's next.

Brilliant post about how the leads will be criticized whether they lead on the guys who they aren't interested in, or they don't give the guys who they aren't interested in a chance. Bottom line, they're not interested in them and that's the nature of the beast. Not to mention, I'm sure Bentley wasn't the only guy on this season who wasn't interested in Ashley but tried to woo her anyway, he was just the rudest (by far).

[Lucas15]

It was a bad idea to tell the guys her little secret about The Bent One's return. She didn't have to. IF JP is her F1, and IF she's done with The Bent One and has moved on, and IF she told JP on his 1:1 date, and IF JP is cool with that -- why tell the other guys at all? IF all that's true they're all MOT guys anyway. So what if they see it on TV? It didn't affect their experience one way or the other if it was always only about JP and his opinion is the only one that matters.

Unless JP's opinion isn't the only one that matters.

You don't think TPTB had anything at all to do with this?

I think that Ashley may have thought it was a good idea to tell JP and that TPTB could have been behind her telling the rest of the guys.

She did have to tell at least F1 - at some point - because she knew it was all being filmed and would be shown when the show aired. The longer she waits before telling F1 the more problems she might have when she finally did tell him. I suspect that her telling JP might have been driven by a desire to control damage before it got bad. She may not have planned to tell anyone other than JP and her telling JP might not have been producer driven.

Once she told JP I think the producers would have wanted her to tell the rest of the guys because it would be harder to keep any semblance of suspense about the ending if viewers see her only telling JP.

[anders]

It's too bad Ashley isn't more articulate or she could have explained the situation a lot better to the guys. However, since the whole premise of this show is that she is dating and possibly developing feelings for multiple guys at the same time, yet not confiding in each one where she stands (or how he compares) with the other ones, it does seem a little ridiculous to get that upset over this. What exactly is the difference between dating Dino, say, while having very strong, or stronger feelings for Bentley and dating Dino while having very strong, or stronger feelings for JP? It's not like Dino can then sabotage JP or beat him up and take him out of contention because he's still there, while with Bentley he can't. Bottom line is she either had feelings for them or she didn't, based on who they were and how they presented themselves to her, none of them has any idea where they stand with Ashley and whether she really likes them better than any of the others, and they are not entitled to know that until the end because that's the premise of the show they signed up for. Despite the Bentley situation, she apparently was developing strong enough feelings for another guy to get engaged to him, so the fact that it wasn't the rest of them ultimately had nothing to do with Bentley but that her connection was stronger with somebody else.

I think their upset is based on her wish for honesty from them and yet she has had this guilty secret regarding Bentley when in real time several of them are having conversations with her about dating history.

nailed it - like she said last week, she felt like a hypocrite for wanting them to be open and honest and she had her own little secret she wasn't sharing - not until Bentley came back and became the elephant in the room.

It does make me wonder if she ever would've come clean if Bent hadn't returned.

[ironcat]

It's too bad Ashley isn't more articulate or she could have explained the situation a lot better to the guys. However, since the whole premise of this show is that she is dating and possibly developing feelings for multiple guys at the same time, yet not confiding in each one where she stands (or how he compares) with the other ones, it does seem a little ridiculous to get that upset over this. What exactly is the difference between dating Dino, say, while having very strong, or stronger feelings for Bentley and dating Dino while having very strong, or stronger feelings for JP? It's not like Dino can then sabotage JP or beat him up and take him out of contention because he's still there, while with Bentley he can't. Bottom line is she either had feelings for them or she didn't, based on who they were and how they presented themselves to her, none of them has any idea where they stand with Ashley and whether she really likes them better than any of the others, and they are not entitled to know that until the end because that's the premise of the show they signed up for. Despite the Bentley situation, she apparently was developing strong enough feelings for another guy to get engaged to him, so the fact that it wasn't the rest of them ultimately had nothing to do with Bentley but that her connection was stronger with somebody else.

I think their upset is based on her wish for honesty from them and yet she has had this guilty secret regarding Bentley when in real time several of them are having conversations with her about dating history.

nailed it - like she said last week, she felt like a hypocrite for wanting them to be open and honest and she had her own little secret she wasn't sharing - not until Bentley came back and became the elephant in the room.

It does make me wonder if she ever would've come clean if Bent hadn't returned.

I guess it's a matter of semantics, but I certainly understand why they would be upset, disappointed, hurt. I still think outrage is a bit of an extreme reaction under the circumstances. We'll have to wait to see how it plays out in its entirety (and then of course take into account how it may have been edited).

[anders]

Absolutely - and we can't forget that the guys also saw the breakdown she had when he left and the things she did say about him being there in the end and that she had tunnel vision and didn't see any of the other guys because she was blinded by Bent. Of course they prolly don't care at this point, but just another 'kick me while I'm down' moment.

[Nibbles22]

Well, certainly in the eyes of the remaining bachelors ~ Bentley
left of his own will. He took himself out of the *competition* early on,
while they were still in L.A. It was his choice. He did not want to be
there.

Now however, they are hearing from Ashley that Bentley is back. This is
nothing short of a bombshell going off in the room. Already I'm sure that
many of them feel that Ashley has been emotionally unavailable ~ it is
obvious to us as viewers. To learn that he is back because she didn't feel
she could openly move forward until there was some sort of closure, has
made every relationship appear insignificant. These men have already had
to do everything possible to stand out from the crowd, and did not know they
were *competing* with the ghost of Bentley. It has got to be humiliating to realize that they have opened their hearts, laid it all on the line,
and discover that Ashley's thoughts have been consumed with 'what might
have been' with Bentley. They are all left looking the fool, and feeling the
fool. With her obvious connection with JP, I can imagine that there is not
one bachelor there who realistically feels he has a snowballs chance in hell
with Ashley. I'm surprised they didn't all walk out!

[CHO]

She has been encouraging them to be honest with her about their feelings; thus, they think she has been honest with them so far. That would be the natural assumption for them to make. Now she tells them that Bentley is back because she needed to find closure which ostensibly they didn't realize - because she had not been "honest" with them about that.
This came as an unwelcome surprise. Is this fair? Evidently, this is a controversial issue!

Meanwhile, some of them called her on it - Mickey in particular. She fires back that if he feels that strongly, he needs to leave which we see him do.
It is interesting to note that the last thing we see in the clip is supposedly Ashley's response to Mickey's leaving which is that she is crying with her hand to her mouth.
It is of course not that she is in love with Mickey, but she called his bluff, and she really didn't mean for him to leave ON HIS OWN TERMS! She doesn't want to lose her suitors ( and her control) until she is ready for it to happen.

Maybe this has been addressed - I'm still catching up --

But she already knows how JP feels about it if she has told him earlier. Perhaps she is upset because she doesn't know how Ben will take it - and is worried that he might decide to leave...

[Reality Mary]

Well, certainly in the eyes of the remaining bachelors ~ Bentley
left of his own will. He took himself out of the *competition* early on,
while they were still in L.A. It was his choice. He did not want to be
there.

Now however, they are hearing from Ashley that Bentley is back. This is
nothing short of a bombshell going off in the room. Already I'm sure that
many of them feel that Ashley has been emotionally unavailable ~ it is
obvious to us as viewers. To learn that he is back because she didn't feel
she could openly move forward until there was some sort of closure, has
made every relationship appear insignificant. These men have already had
to do everything possible to stand out from the crowd, and did not know they
were *competing* with the ghost of Bentley. It has got to be humiliating to realize that they have opened their hearts, laid it all on the line,
and discover that Ashley's thoughts have been consumed with 'what might
have been' with Bentley. They are all left looking the fool, and feeling the
fool. With her obvious connection with JP, I can imagine that there is not
one bachelor there who realistically feels he has a snowballs chance in hell
with Ashley. I'm surprised they didn't all walk out!

Great post! Maybe they wonder what else she isn't telling them.

[ironcat]

Well, certainly in the eyes of the remaining bachelors ~ Bentley
left of his own will. He took himself out of the *competition* early on,
while they were still in L.A. It was his choice. He did not want to be
there.

Now however, they are hearing from Ashley that Bentley is back. This is
nothing short of a bombshell going off in the room. Already I'm sure that
many of them feel that Ashley has been emotionally unavailable ~ it is
obvious to us as viewers. To learn that he is back because she didn't feel
she could openly move forward until there was some sort of closure, has
made every relationship appear insignificant. These men have already had
to do everything possible to stand out from the crowd, and did not know they
were *competing* with the ghost of Bentley. It has got to be humiliating to realize that they have opened their hearts, laid it all on the line,
and discover that Ashley's thoughts have been consumed with 'what might
have been' with Bentley. They are all left looking the fool, and feeling the
fool. With her obvious connection with JP, I can imagine that there is not
one bachelor there who realistically feels he has a snowballs chance in hell
with Ashley. I'm surprised they didn't all walk out!

If you are competing for a prize that everyone wants to win badly, giving it your all, and you find out that the rules have been tampered with, decreasing your chances of winning said prize, you of course will be outraged. This scenario does not describe what is happening here. IMO, most of these guys are not really interested in the prize and are just playing along, enjoying the free travel. If they are angry because they feel they have been made to look like fools, that's their egos talking, not their hearts.

[jlccaz]

She has been encouraging them to be honest with her about their feelings; thus, they think she has been honest with them so far. That would be the natural assumption for them to make. Now she tells them that Bentley is back because she needed to find closure which ostensibly they didn't realize - because she had not been "honest" with them about that.
This came as an unwelcome surprise. Is this fair? Evidently, this is a controversial issue!

Meanwhile, some of them called her on it - Mickey in particular. She fires back that if he feels that strongly, he needs to leave which we see him do.
It is interesting to note that the last thing we see in the clip is supposedly Ashley's response to Mickey's leaving which is that she is crying with her hand to her mouth.
It is of course not that she is in love with Mickey, but she called his bluff, and she really didn't mean for him to leave ON HIS OWN TERMS! She doesn't want to lose her suitors ( and her control) until she is ready for it to happen.

Maybe this has been addressed - I'm still catching up --

But she already knows how JP feels about it if she has told him earlier. Perhaps she is upset because she doesn't know how Ben will take it - and is worried that he might decide to leave...

Yes, but...she might also be "upset" because she knows she has JP locked down as F1, but still needs to endure weeks more of filming at that point, and needs to make pretty pictures with guys she likes on HTDs, in fantasy suites, meeting her parents. If there is a Mutiny on "her" Bounty, she would be an object of derision and ridicule when the show aired (which has indeed been somewhat the case, thanks to her Bentley subplot.

What kind of a TV show they are making and will be aired is generally of equal, if not greater, anxiety or importance than finding a husband. They know that they will find a husband in all likelihood on or after the show. What they don't know is that havoc will be played with their personal reputation on network primetime and in the tabloids.

[Lucas15]

With her obvious connection with JP, I can imagine that there is not
one bachelor there who realistically feels he has a snowballs chance in hell
with Ashley. I'm surprised they didn't all walk out!

Interesting comment. It seems most all of the guys who have done exit interviews have acknowledged the connection with JP and commented on it - to a larger consistency than I remember with past shows. So not only may that connection be obvious to us - it's obvious to the guys. What should also be obvious to the guys who have been on dates with her is that she is remarkably unavailable emotionally - those dates look like excuses to stay at arms length both physically and emotionally; I thought the venue of a Thai Temple where kissing isn't allowed was a most bizarre date for this show.

Perhaps the real issue is that most all of the guys now feel like MOT cast members and would sort of like it all to be over so they can go home.

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