*NO SPOILERS* The Bachelorette 10 - Episode Discussion

Cari wrote:Warning: a very looooooong post AND a lot of headbanging ahead. From now on, picture me, WW constantly headbanging till the AFTR. haha

Before I reply to your posts upthread, let me begin first by saying I just watched the deleted video of Josh and Andi:

“Josh surprises Andi”


When Andi said and I quote,

"Josh is extremely kind and caring. I look for that in those qualities in a guy. He’s kind. He’s compassionate. He has potential to be a great father and a great husband.” (from 00:05)

TPTB, this video solidified my opinion that you are freaking hiding many facets of Josh! When the heck was Josh kind? Wait, “EXTREMELY” kind, caring, compassionate. Did I miss an episode?!  For a second there, methinks, it was Nick getting the physical edit! Did Andi in anyway describe Nick as a great father and a great husband?! Didn’t Andi describe Nick’s relationship as “passionate” then showed them making out under a tree! We would have loved to have “witnessed” what Andi is talking about regarding Josh!TPTB, I heychoo!!!  I am comforted that Andi knows Josh hence her F1. Still, I feel shortchanged! I like what I’ve seen with Nick and Andi when they’re together. TPTB was successful in weaving a very textured Nick albeit colorful “character”. But evidences cut out that would show Josh having a deeper connection with Andis now not just a guess! Statements from Andi such as these confirm that it was purposely hidden from us!   Jodi’s conversations revolved around doubts and “insecurities” when I’m now certain they’ve talked about much more than "that"! It’s a huge deal! I’m thoroughly disappointed for TPTB not showing us more Jodi moments. Therefore, this heightens my gut feel that Nick is the visible F2 and Josh the hidden F1.


Which brings me to your posts upthread,

GrahamGal wrote:Hey WW, you're back!

Love what you said above, but I have 2 questions:

When you talk about Josh getting the physical edit I have to ask why then does he not get the beach FSD? If he is going to be the physical edit only could they at least show him with his shirt off please?

If Josh was getting TB edit why would they not show him as more than just a jock?  Shouldn't they be showing him as this multi-dimentional man?  I see it, but I think it is too subtle for your average view (admit it we are not average viewers) to really see.

luvlady345 wrote:Agree GG, if Josh was getting the physical edit why wouldn't they have him on the beach with Andi?

EXACTLY! Thank you for bringing them up. I so agree now more than ever!   They would have exploited every freaking episode with Josh shirtless. Hello, Sean, statue? i mean is that you? haha Seducing the women watching to drool over a prize catch next TB. I’ve stated previously that either Josh is F1 or the next Bachelor. For TPTB, having Josh as the possible next Bachelor is non-negotiable. So your observations are correct, the Too Good To Be True statements are from Andi. Instead, we don’t see the typical edit of the next Bachelor with Josh. As I’ve said also, I’m getting the vibe that Chris is the next potential Bachelor. TPTB knows the ending already.    Surely if Josh is F2, his edit would be an edit showcasing him as the next lead.


 
 

They hid this heavenly body from us all!

WHY?!!!   

I’ve another observation.

Am I right, don’t the F1 usually feel unsure he is the final one? Cloud of doubts hovers around him. Josh is not confident on Andi’s feelings for him. TPTB would put a seed of doubt on the F1 whereas to the F2, boy, they want drama in the end hence they will make the F2 believe HE IS IT! In the past, Jason would say that TPTB would tell him that he is Deanna’s pick that's why he went down on his knee and proposed! He was so confident he was the final pick. As already mentioned in previous posts, din’t Ben have that classic F2 “confidence” that's why he was “furious”, caught off guard, left the podium huffing and puffing?

Rewind Nick’s statements.   UhHuh. Confident, right? For some, “over” confident and arrogant. Classic F2 that would leave him heartbroken at the end. WAIT! I love him to be the next Bach. Fine. That’s another story. How about Josh? He ain’t confident! What the heck is TPTB whispering to him?   

Confident F2 vs Uncertain F1

In episode 7, in a group date, Nick said about the guys left, “they don’t matter…” comparing himself with them, implying that the guys would like to be him, “they’d like to be, they’d want to be…” ... “at this point, I feel like it’s me and there’s no one else. There’s no second. There’s no third.” And then in their little one on one, he bravely tells Andi that he feels Andi feels something for him, “I don’t want to put words in your mouth..I feel it” In his ITM, “getting a rose says a lot of things..there are a lot of things (Andi) can’t say to me like I’m falling in love with you or you’re right for me or by the way I’m pretty sure I’ll marry you..” Nick feels that when Andi gives him the HTD rose, “it’s her saying all those things back to me..” And finally when she was given the GDR, and with nary a doubt Nick says, “andi gives me the rose and I truly feel, I feel like she told me she loves me. I had confidence before. It’s at its peak.” To Nick, the GDR is a confirmation of Andi’s feelings to him. Later when Nick comes back, his sincerity was questioned by the boys and he said, “I don’t care what the other guys think…. I’m confident I’ll end up with Andi.” At the RC, talking about his coming HTD, he was excited to talk to his friends and family about Andi, “excited to tell them how I feel about her. I definitely found that person. Fallen in love with her and pretty sure she’s fallen in love with me. It’s pretty awesome…” Nick was crying while he was saying this. I wanted to hug him and comfort him because I felt that this very, very confident man, full of emotions, crying. Would be the same man crying in the end.

As F2. TPTB is setting him up for a mighty heartbreak.   

Whereas Josh at his HTD, “I’m very protective of my entire family. And bringing somebody like andi is definitely bringing my guard down. Being vulnerable.. And a possible heartbreak because as much as I’m in love with her.. at the end of the day, she makes decision in the end…”

Awwww, babe.... (As andi would say    )  

That to me is acknowledging there is another guy. He is sure of what he feels for Andi but he is uncertain of what Andi feels.

To me Nick’s confident attitude is a classic F2. Blindsided. Shocked. Heartbreak. Ben F/Lindsey/Clare like exit.

Whereas Josh. Would be a tearful mess just like in the HTD. Perfect romantic ending. JP/Catherine like ending.  Arggh. Cannot wait.

Not WW at this point.  :P 

Nick is next Bachelor!

Josh is F1!   


Eta:

check out 00:47?
Josh says, "These are the 7 you’ve given me… while this… when on my knee proposing…”   

And Andi says, ‘awww, BABE!!!!!!!... cute”  :sweetheart: 

Andi called Josh…. BABE!

Geez, Jodi, STOPPPPPPP!

Not. Hahaha

   She calls him BABE....I have never heard that part before, I knew she loves him but BUT, DANG...BABEEEE! 

    

WW,

You are spot on with your post. At first I was not agreeing about Josh being uncertain about her feeling, but I can see your point. Personally I think that Josh is a little more certain that he lets on, but not enough to verbalize it. He is very aware there are other guys there. He even expressed that back during the B2M GD right before he got the rose.

I thought it was interesting they left in Nick saying his confidence peaked when he got the HT GDR. Once you reach the peak there is nowhere to go but down.

sophienette wrote:Spoiler free F3 video:

http://sophienettejc.thedeadone.net/2014/07/14/video-for-andi-her-final-3-la-vie-en-rose/


Enjoy!

Thanks Sophie! I think you did a great job of capturing all three of these guys and their relationship with Andi.

So, confidence, eh? It's like this true story. The family was playing Apples to Apples (remember, all 'kids' are in their 30's). The adjective we are trying to match is SMART. Hooray! I have this in the bag, because I have ROCKET SCIENTIST. Woo hoo! I lay my card down with a teeny bit of 'tude. All cards are gathered, and the nouns all read, and. I. Lose. Yep, rocket scientist lost because DUH (of all people) had ALBERT EINSTEIN. So, you never know which card you're holding. In this analogy, Nick is holding rocket scientist, but he does not realize that Josh is holding Einstein. See? Reality TV mirrors life. OK, you can stop laughing now. And, btw, this group is great!

Fabulous, in2deep.

So true, Cari, GG and I2d!!

in2deep wrote:So, confidence, eh? It's like this true story. The family was playing Apples to Apples (remember, all 'kids' are in their 30's).  The adjective we are trying to match is SMART. Hooray! I have this in the bag, because I have ROCKET SCIENTIST. Woo hoo! I lay my card down with a teeny bit of 'tude. All cards are gathered, and the nouns all read, and. I. Lose. Yep, rocket scientist lost because DUH (of all people) had ALBERT EINSTEIN.  So, you never know which card you're holding. In this analogy, Nick is holding rocket scientist, but he does not realize that Josh is holding Einstein. See? Reality TV mirrors life. OK, you can stop laughing now.  And, btw, this group is great!

I love that game and that is a perfect analogy.

I love this group too.   

Also if we are to be forever #teamidiot if she picks Nick we need to figure out a team name if she picks Chris or Josh.  For Chris I will throw out #teamwtf and for Josh while the easy name would be #teamgenius that may be going to far.  So if Josh is F1 I nominate us as #teamicanseethroughtheeditoftptb.

How about Team Can't Hide the Love? Gives TPTB a little less power. Or Team TGTBT (Too Good to be True). I hope they play the ding at their wedding... You 're Just Too Hood to be True. Aaa sigh - I am gushing. And hoping he's got the Einstein card:)

How about #teameinstein since we were all so smart.   Nice i2d!

I vote team TGTBT! Love that song too i2d!!
Ditto on this is the best group! :
I can't wait for tonight!

Just to throw a different perspective into the mix I am going to put some entries I have made over in the spoiler side, however these posts are taken from my observations with the spoiler aside, based on what I am seeing on screen:
If you take away the make-out sessions, ITMs, voice overs etc. and just focus on the edit (in comparison to past seasons) the following are arguments that Nick is F1:

1. "He gets me" - This is being repeated constantly, she finally says it in a non ITM/voice over to his little sister. TPTB are making sure we know they have a mental/intellectual connection, while still showing their intense physical scenes.

2. "What type of parent will you be" - She and Nick have had conversations on how they will be as parents. We have not seen this same conversation with Josh, they probably have had a conversation I would think, so why aren’t we seeing it?

3. "If you were my husband" - She says this to Nick when they are in Marseilles, discussing the issues in the house and indicating if they were married would he confide in her. Has Andi challenged Josh in this way and referred to their potential future i.e. “marriage”? I don’t remember this happening with them so please correct me if I am wrong.

4. The extra time and Andi’s extra attention - Nick has gotten the most time with Andi, two 1-on-1s, late night rendezvous & one mini 1-on-1. He has also received a lot of Andi’s attention and reassurance – FIR, GDR leading to extra time (even after time spent together earlier in the week), special Venice date with the tux etc. Now this was a major issue for Andi’s dad Hy last season, how could he believe his daughter was JP’s one and only if she got her first 1-on-1 date in episode 6 (Josh’s was in episode 5). Further he indicated that roses and attention were things that his daughter should have received if she was JP’s one, I think that Nick has surpassed Josh in this sense.

Now most of the above occurred before the two key moments, as others have mentioned (and I agree) which may indicate Josh as Andi’s F1:

1. When he said he was falling in love, she absolutely lit up, completely different than with Nick IMO. Also Andi indicating that Brussels was a great week (Josh says he is falling in love, vs Venice an OK week, Nick says he is falling in love but Andi and Josh have the disagreement).

2. The Marseilles breakdown that we saw in the promo but not in full in the episode, to me a result of the disagreement with Josh, the real full meltdown we have seen, apart from the Eric disagreement which I think was a result of exhaustion, alcohol and pressure.

For #1 I think it could be argued that part of Venice being an "OK" week could still be attributed to Nick, as he continued to have issues with the guys, which CH alluded to in his blog. Also could argue that Brussels being her great week could be due to all the private time with Nick, not just Josh, as they had a LOT of private time together.

Despite these two clues potentially pointing to Josh, a huge clue to me is Nick got the typical F1 FS date. I know that there is the argument that because of Josh’s background in baseball that this date had to go to him, BUT, they could have done that and then gone to the beach (basing this on the preview, so maybe tonight I will be proven wrong). To me the fact that ONLY one guy got her in a bikini, especially considering knowing how she feels about being in a bathing suit (she only wore a one-piece during JP’s season), speak volumes to me.

In past seasons the F1 usually gets the secluded beach date (i.e. Jef, Emily, Roberto). On this date, as has been indicated by past contestants (i.e. Deanna I believe alluded to this) the couple will get time alone on the beach as the producers will get their footage and then leave the couple alone for a bit. Further to this the couple, will get A LOT of alone time without mics in the water where no one but each other can hear what they are saying.

Based on what we have seen in the preview only Nick gets this alone time with Andi. Now I know that past F2 and F3 have gotten beach dates (i.e. Ashley, Sean etc), however based on the preview only ONE guy gets the beach date, a date where Andi can wrap her bikini laded body around one guy, a date where Andi can say whatever she wants with no one hearing to one guy, that one guy being Nick.

Sorry for the long post just trying to play a little devil's advocate for you guys ;)