DWTS Season 19 - Discussion - *Spoilers*

thirteen wrote:

SLA44 wrote:IMO if Derek was given someone like any of those three you (umngirl) mentioned he would "phone it in" or just walk.  He is their golden boy and they are not going to give him anyone like that ~ JMO.  I also thought that Amy did better with Mark than she did with Derek because she actually danced with him where with Derek she did more sitting down or being carried around than she did dancing.  Sure Derek did some creative choreography to keep her from dancing and then there was the fogging of the floor so you couldn't even see her feet and you had no idea if they were even on the floor or if Derek was just carrying her.  Again JMO I'm not a Derek or Julianne fan, I think they both think they are better than anyone else out there.  

What has give you that impression of Derek? I have always seen him as a proper man who doesn't say every five seconds that he has won more than anyone else and he always is happy for the partnership that wins. And if you think about it the other person (meaning Tom or Brooke or anyone else) is always bringing that fact up. Derek has never said: "I'm the champion of champions" actually when they bring that up he answer quickly or not at all.
As for Julianne, yeah I can see where you are coming from.

P.S. Derek is not at fault for being DWTS "golden boy". He doesn't make the decision of who he wants to be paired with so why fault him? This is coming from a Derek/Mark and Maks/Val fan! (Yes, it can be done)

I was not a Derek fan until Kelly.  I thought he had an attitude and Kelly brought out a softer, more compassionate side to Derek. Derek himself said that his partnership with Kelly changed him.  They were magic together and that is why in the end they were able to beat Zendaya, who probably had more dance training and background.

The only year that I thought Derek didn't deserve his crown was Nicole S.  She was such a nasty piece of work and so far ahead of anyone else in training and talent, it just wasn't fair.  I know Derek was only doing his job, but I disliked her so much, that I still resent that one of the five trophies, the others, nope, he worked really hard and made the best of his partners.  

I agree, I may not be fair in hating the Nicole S win, since I loved Meryl and Maks, but that one still bugs me.  I actually gave up the show until Sean was on because of that one.

I also think you can think Derek is the most talented of the choreographers and still think he has been given some advantage when it comes to partners. I think Mark has as well, though as I already stated, Mark doesn't bring out the best in all his partners like Derek does. While I thought Derek's dance with NeNe was a joke, I also gave him credit for not just dancing around her like Julianne or Mark would have done. I just expected awesome Derek to be able to do more with NeNe, probably because I do think Derek is one of the best on the show.

stuckinsc wrote:Tristan: 
13 Nancy Grace 5th
14 Gladys Knight 8th
15 Pamela Anderson 13th
16 Dorothy Hamill 12th
17 Valerie Harper 10th

Why'd they always give him the older women, I'd love to see him back with some one younger. I'd of laughed if Derek would have had these all in a row like he did. 
Wish Derek and Tony could trade partners just for my amusement.   

thirteen-glad you can see that Derek is the golden boy-and your right, it's not his fault...just frustrating to me because it's so obvious.

thirteen wrote:

SLA44 wrote:IMO if Derek was given someone like any of those three you (umngirl) mentioned he would "phone it in" or just walk.  He is their golden boy and they are not going to give him anyone like that ~ JMO.  I also thought that Amy did better with Mark than she did with Derek because she actually danced with him where with Derek she did more sitting down or being carried around than she did dancing.  Sure Derek did some creative choreography to keep her from dancing and then there was the fogging of the floor so you couldn't even see her feet and you had no idea if they were even on the floor or if Derek was just carrying her.  Again JMO I'm not a Derek or Julianne fan, I think they both think they are better than anyone else out there.  

What has give you that impression of Derek? I have always seen him as a proper man who doesn't say every five seconds that he has won more than anyone else and he always is happy for the partnership that wins. And if you think about it the other person (meaning Tom or Brooke or anyone else) is always bringing that fact up. Derek has never said: "I'm the champion of champions" actually when they bring that up he answer quickly or not at all.
As for Julianne, yeah I can see where you are coming from.

P.S. Derek is not at fault for being DWTS "golden boy". He doesn't make the decision of who he wants to be paired with so why fault him? This is coming from a Derek/Mark and Maks/Val fan! (Yes, it can be done)

I find him to be very smug for one thing but I did vote for Kellie Pickler when she was on so that was voting for Derek and I didn't have the animosity towards him then. He also did some outstanding choreography that season. I did not watch season 17 when he won with Amber so I cannot comment about anything on that season and the only reason I watched season 16 was because Kellie was on it and I liked her from American Idol. I didn't watch season 17 because the show was not the same to me without Maks and if Kellie had not been on season 16 I wouldn't have watched it either. Derek made some unkind remarks in interviews about Maks when he was out promoting his book. This is what he said in an interview with USA Today:

Leading lesson: Power over others is weakness in disguise. Fellow Dancing With the Stars pro Maksim Chmerkovskiy, known as the bad boy of the ballroom, is really insecure. Hough says Maks and his Olympic skater partner Meryl Davis were never dating, despite their closeness on the show. "No," he says, explaining that the show created a story line for them: Meryl became the coach, Maks became the student. "I've always known this," says Hough, "but (Maks) is incredibly insecure. He's not confident in what he does as much as he puts it out. So he overcompensates. If you think about it, that's why people lash out, get angry or frustrated - is out of fear. If you're very confident in who you are, you wouldn't have reason to lash out." wrote:

IMO if Derek were confident in who he was he wouldn't have to be talking about fellow competitors behind their backs like this. Do I believe the show created a story line for them that resulted in the chemistry those two had on the floor - no that kind of chemistry cannot be faked and the judges complimented them on it and how well they danced together all the time. Maks also got complimented on the choreography he did with Meryl. Both of them had stated in interviews after the show was over that what the viewers saw was real. IMO I think there was some jealousy going on there with Derek and I don't think he liked losing to Maks one bit. I do think that Amy was happy for them though. I have never heard Maks make one unfavorable comment or remark about anyone of his competitors or anyone for that matter other than he didn't pay any attention to anything that one guest judge had to say. Maybe Derek should take a lesson here from Maks instead of making remarks about fellow competitors like he did here. JMO

That's the only bad thing I have seen or read Derek talk about someone else. Ever.
And as a fan of also Maks I can tell you with absolute certainty that him has made more than five bad comments towards Derek. So who wins in the bad comment poll: Maks, for sure.

Also I don't think he was jealous I just think he had enough (and a little bad wording in his part). We are forgetting that they are people, just like us, and that they lose his cool sometimes. If you hit then better be prepare to receive a hit and Maks has been "hitting" Derek for awhile that I think that was D's breaking point. What I admire about Derek is that later in that day he made a statement apologizing to Maks via twitter and also via phone which I haven't seen Maks ever doing it (obviously via social media).

Have a great day! And I think this season is gonna be great, they all have fun personalities and I don't see any showmance so yes!

Lost17 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:Tristan: 
13 Nancy Grace 5th
14 Gladys Knight 8th
15 Pamela Anderson 13th
16 Dorothy Hamill 12th
17 Valerie Harper 10th

Why'd they always give him the older women, I'd love to see him back with some one younger. I'd of laughed if Derek would have had these all in a row like he did. 
Wish Derek and Tony could trade partners just for my amusement.   

thirteen-glad you can see that Derek is the golden boy-and your right, it's not his fault...just frustrating to me because it's so obvious.

I think we also have to factor in that celebrities probably ask for Derek - they know he knows how to win. And the producers are going to make their celebrities happy, especially the ones that they think fans will root for. None of it is Derek's fault. Sure, he probably has an ego, and it all feeds that ego, but he IS the best at what he does.

I love Maks and if I were the celebrity I'd be asking for Maks first, Tristan second - but I'm a drooling older lady, not a youngster.

I really think a lot of it has had to do with who the celebrities ask for.

dw_a_mom wrote:

Lost17 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:Tristan: 
13 Nancy Grace 5th
14 Gladys Knight 8th
15 Pamela Anderson 13th
16 Dorothy Hamill 12th
17 Valerie Harper 10th

Why'd they always give him the older women, I'd love to see him back with some one younger. I'd of laughed if Derek would have had these all in a row like he did. 
Wish Derek and Tony could trade partners just for my amusement.   

thirteen-glad you can see that Derek is the golden boy-and your right, it's not his fault...just frustrating to me because it's so obvious.

I think we also have to factor in that celebrities probably ask for Derek - they know he knows how to win.  And the producers are going to make their celebrities happy, especially the ones that they think fans will root for.  None of it is Derek's fault.  Sure, he probably has an ego, and it all feeds that ego, but he IS the best at what he does.

I love Maks and if I were the celebrity I'd be asking for Maks first, Tristan second - but I'm a drooling older lady, not a youngster.

I really think a lot of it has had to do with who the celebrities ask for.

I don't think that's it because I doubt the stars have much say in who they get. Derek is their golden boy and therefore they mostly give him the cakewalk partners. May not be his fault but I wonder what the others feel about it. Even his sister had at least one bad partner. Poor Cheryl who won twice early on and is also very good has had a few old guys and non-dancers. Having said all that I do think Derek's an excellent choreographer but would like it to be a little more fair.

I agree that Derek has never once had a "dud" partner, and he has also had a few who I knew from the moment they were announced were going to win (Jennifer, Nicole, Amber). That wasn't only because of their assumed natural dance ability (which is not the same thing as having had lessons; it's an innate talent of movement that you can just see; even Amy, despite her handicap, knew how to move; I saw it in her first dance and knew she'd go far), but because it was obvious they'd be starting the show with a huge fan base (Jennifer and Amber), which, unless they were awful, would most likely carry them to the end.  Yes, there have been others who I knew would win from the get go who got other pros (Shawn Johnson, Meryl, JR and some of the football players as soon as it was apparent they had natural ability), but Derek is the only one who seems to get these types routinely (they finally gifted Maks with one before he retired), plus never gets a clunker who has no chance from the get go, like Tony and Tristan seem to get more often than not.

That said, I understand why the producers don't want Derek to be eliminated in the first few weeks, which, as talented and clever a choreographer as he is, would happen if he had Diana Nyad last season, for example; he is a draw for the show, and his routines are always talked about and give them added publicity.   But it's disingenuous to believe that the pros are all given the same chance to win with the partner assignments, and that Derek's vast success over the rest hasn't been in part due to being given an advantage when it comes to partners.

ironcat wrote:I agree that Derek has never once had a "dud" partner, and he has also had a few who I knew from the moment they were announced were going to win (Jennifer, Nicole, Amber). That wasn't only because of their assumed natural dance ability (which is not the same thing as having had lessons; it's an innate talent of movement that you can just see; even Amy, despite her handicap, knew how to move; I saw it in her first dance and knew she'd go far), but because it was obvious they'd be starting the show with a huge fan base (Jennifer and Amber), which, unless they were awful, would most likely carry them to the end.  Yes, there have been others who I knew would win from the get go who got other pros (Shawn Johnson, Meryl, JR and some of the football players as soon as it was apparent they had natural ability), but Derek is the only one who seems to get these types routinely (they finally gifted Maks with one before he retired), plus never gets a clunker who has no chance from the get go, like Tony and Tristan seem to get more often than not.

That said, I understand why the producers don't want Derek to be eliminated in the first few weeks, which, as talented and clever a choreographer as he is, would happen if he had Diana Nyad last season, for example; he is a draw for the show, and his routines are always talked about and give them added publicity.   But it's disingenuous to believe that the pros are all given the same chance to win with the partner assignments, and that Derek's vast success over the rest hasn't been in part due to being given an advantage when it comes to partners.

One of the show producers explained that Tristan and Tony get the older ladies because they are the most patient and therefore equipped to deal with the older contestants. I also recall Tony saying in an interview that the older female contestants asks for him to be their partner. Apparently, word has gone out that he is even-keeled and able to be patient with everyone.

SLA44 wrote:

thirteen wrote:

SLA44 wrote:IMO if Derek was given someone like any of those three you (umngirl) mentioned he would "phone it in" or just walk.  He is their golden boy and they are not going to give him anyone like that ~ JMO.  I also thought that Amy did better with Mark than she did with Derek because she actually danced with him where with Derek she did more sitting down or being carried around than she did dancing.  Sure Derek did some creative choreography to keep her from dancing and then there was the fogging of the floor so you couldn't even see her feet and you had no idea if they were even on the floor or if Derek was just carrying her.  Again JMO I'm not a Derek or Julianne fan, I think they both think they are better than anyone else out there.  

What has give you that impression of Derek? I have always seen him as a proper man who doesn't say every five seconds that he has won more than anyone else and he always is happy for the partnership that wins. And if you think about it the other person (meaning Tom or Brooke or anyone else) is always bringing that fact up. Derek has never said: "I'm the champion of champions" actually when they bring that up he answer quickly or not at all.
As for Julianne, yeah I can see where you are coming from.

P.S. Derek is not at fault for being DWTS "golden boy". He doesn't make the decision of who he wants to be paired with so why fault him? This is coming from a Derek/Mark and Maks/Val fan! (Yes, it can be done)

I find him to be very smug for one thing but I did vote for Kellie Pickler when she was on so that was voting for Derek and I didn't have the animosity towards him then.  He also did some outstanding choreography that season.  I did not watch season 17 when he won with Amber so I cannot comment about anything on that season and the only reason I watched season 16 was because Kellie was on it and I liked her from American Idol.  I didn't watch season 17 because the show was not the same to me without Maks and if Kellie had not been on season 16 I wouldn't have watched it either.  Derek made some unkind remarks in interviews about Maks when he was out promoting his book.  This is what he said in an interview with USA Today:


IMO if Derek were confident in who he was he wouldn't have to be talking about fellow competitors behind their backs like this.  Do I believe the show created a story line for them that resulted in the chemistry those two had on the floor - no that kind of chemistry cannot be faked and the judges complimented them on it and how well they danced together all the time.  Maks also got complimented on the choreography he did with Meryl.  Both of them had stated in interviews after the show was over that what the viewers saw was real.  IMO I think there was some jealousy going on there with Derek and I don't think he liked losing to Maks one bit.  I do think that Amy was happy for them though.  I have never heard Maks make one unfavorable comment or remark about anyone of his competitors or anyone for that matter other than he didn't pay any attention to anything that one guest judge had to say.  Maybe Derek should take a lesson here from Maks instead of making remarks about fellow competitors like he did here.  JMO

Derek, Mark, Maks and Val all trained with Mark's parents when they were teenagers. Mark's mom had mentioned in an interview that there is a rivalry amongst the four which has been lingering for years.

Personally, I have seen a LOT of growth and maturity in Derek in the last couple of years and I sincerely believe that a lot of people are still judging him based on the person he was several seasons ago. I like the person Derek has grown to become and more so, I like the brotherhood/friendship thing he has with Mark.

dw_a_mom wrote:

Lost17 wrote:

stuckinsc wrote:Tristan: 
13 Nancy Grace 5th
14 Gladys Knight 8th
15 Pamela Anderson 13th
16 Dorothy Hamill 12th
17 Valerie Harper 10th

Why'd they always give him the older women, I'd love to see him back with some one younger. I'd of laughed if Derek would have had these all in a row like he did. 
Wish Derek and Tony could trade partners just for my amusement.   

thirteen-glad you can see that Derek is the golden boy-and your right, it's not his fault...just frustrating to me because it's so obvious.

I think we also have to factor in that celebrities probably ask for Derek - they know he knows how to win.  And the producers are going to make their celebrities happy, especially the ones that they think fans will root for.  None of it is Derek's fault.  Sure, he probably has an ego, and it all feeds that ego, but he IS the best at what he does.

I love Maks and if I were the celebrity I'd be asking for Maks first, Tristan second - but I'm a drooling older lady, not a youngster.

I really think a lot of it has had to do with who the celebrities ask for.

Yes, agree on some of the celebrities asking for their favorites, and the bigger ones get who they want I would think.

As much as I love Maks, I'd be scared to be partnered with him.   I'm no Meryl unfortunately, and I love that side she brought out. I'd probably want Artem or Tristan.

july-had no idea those 4 trained together. Was Julianne trained by Mark's parents too? 

Not a Derek fan really, but I do appreciate his choreography too. I also like that's he's been 'nicer' and was great with Maks this year.

I'll probably watch the first episode, while fast forwarding through the judges, and see how it goes. I do like Sadie-not Mark so much though. Wish she was with Artem.

I know that Derek, Julianne and Mark all trained with Marks parents in England. Julychild I have never heard before that Maks and Val had trained with them and really doubt that had happened especially since Derek and Julianne moved to England to train with Mark and by Marks parents. Maks opened his first dance studio in NY or NJ with his father in 1999 when Maks was only 19. Maks is 5 years older than Derek and 6 years older than Mark so it is very unlikely they trained together as teenagers. I know that Maks is friends with Mark's father but if you have a link to something that shows they all trained together I would appreciate you sharing it because I have never seen anything even relating to that.

Mark and Derek are close buddies and are also in a band together and they just bought a house together.

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Maks and Val are very close siblings and share residences together in NJ and CA.

SLA44 wrote:I know that Derek, Julianne and Mark all trained with Marks parents in England.  Julychild I have never heard before that Maks and Val had trained with them and really doubt that had happened especially since Derek and Julianne moved to England to train with Mark and by Marks parents.  Maks opened his first dance studio in NY or NJ with his father in 1999 when Maks was only 19.  Maks is 5 years older than Derek and 6 years older than Mark so it is very unlikely they trained together as teenagers.  I know that Maks is friends with Mark's father but if you have a link to something that shows they all trained together I would appreciate you sharing it because I have never seen anything even relating to that.

Mark and Derek are close buddies and are also in a band together and they just bought a house together.  

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Maks and Val are very close siblings and share residences together in NJ and CA.  

I hadn't either and I've been following Maks for some time now, was wondering how I hadn't heard it before.