The Bachelor 20 - Ben Higgins - Episode 9 - Discussion - #2 *Sleuthing - Spoilers*

Thank goodness for Castle after this nonsense tonight. #SmallVictories

nutty1 wrote:So am I the only one who thinks he slept with all 3 of them?

Also, those who mentioned producer manipulation, in what way? Do you think they coerced him to say ILY that many times to both of them? I am really curious to know your thoughts.

Personally, I don't think he slept with all three. Two tops.

JMO...They manipulated him by making him doubt that Lauren cared about him by telling him she hasn't told you she loves you and they told her not to tell him. They also made her date last just to make sure. Then they made him to a whole lot of voiceovers after the fact that would emphasise his telling both of them so that the audience would be beaten over the head with it...just in case we didn't get it.

soccermom333 wrote:

mizzoufan wrote:Mike Fleiss ‏@fleissmeister  3h3 hours ago
Ben does a reverse Womack... But does he stick the landing?

So he picks both? and dates them both like Jen did

I never thought about this.    You might be onto something!  Charlie did it too.  Actually I believe the spoiler.  

Nope

I don't think he is going to date anyone. He says he is ready to propose in one (or multiple previews.)

He finally did ! I'm impressed (insert sarcasm)
I'm way more excited for ATFR than finale

will definitely gonna watch this episode later tonight

All I will say is the editors deserve an Emmy.  They do a great job of causing confusion.  I had hoped even with the ILYs that his pick would be a little clearer to me.  I still think it's Lauren but will not be shocked if it's JoJo. Hopefully we can get some hints from the preview screen caps.

nutty1 wrote:So am I the only one who thinks he slept with all 3 of them?

Also, those who mentioned producer manipulation, in what way? Do you think they coerced him to say ILY that many times to both of them? I am really curious to know your thoughts.

Like i mentioned up thread ... I think the producers watch and wait for any opportunity to make the season more "interesting" and once he sid it to Jojo, i think they would have no problem talking him into just letting all his feelings out and not hold nything back. most guys should know better but I think Ben is just that naive to believe that by expressing his love for both was just him being honest about his conflicted emotional ties to the two girls.

northernviewer wrote:Im trying to tie this in with what CH said about reminding him about saying he loved someome?  We know the Jojo's date was first and he said ILy to her in the afternoon portion of date.  Did a producer talk to him and convince him that now that he's slipped up it would be best for him to not hold back fom expressing his feelings for both girls???   I have a feeling in his naivete, he was convinced declaring his lve to both was in his best interest.

It was aired first, but sleuthed that Lauren's was filmed last.

This is what I feel at this point: he said it a lot to Jojo before Lauren. He loved Jojo- no one is denying this. (he must have told Lauren because he'd be an absolute dumba** not to )- even more than he was for saying "ILY" left and right at all. Once he heard it from Lauren, he was sure he wanted to propose to Lauren. BUT, this is a show...TPTB told him he had to keep perpetuating the fantasy (that he might want Jojo) for another week until the proposal to Lauren to give the show enough material. He had to have a MTP with 2 women. The finale would be 30 minutes long...NO suspense. Everyone turns the channel. Nothing to cook up a preview with. It wasn't an act until he got his ILY from Lauren, but then, I think that changed everything. I really hope this doesn't ruin it for them.

Jojo got the physical edit with the closeup of her boobs and shot to the bottom in the hot tub.

Yes, Lauren crying in the preview and she saying he could be in love with 2 people was very graceful and understanding.  Real pain if let go, but not blindside. Jojo...though she has alluded to the fact that he could love someone else, she's starting to believe it's she and he together (blindside)...producers are probably filling her ear, too, and increasing doubt in Lauren to get these reactions from them. I'd love it if he said at the AFTR that Lo was his PERSON, too...but then he could say, but Jojo's also my person... he was crushed at having to let her (or Lauren), but I believe Jojo go.
The RC was SO weird.  

Could Lauren leave in a limo if she came in a copter? Reflecting back, I think JP came in a copter, too. Ben, a boat. Ben left in the boat.


Maybe Ben just stormed off, no boat - just didn't want to talk to Ash anymore (so fuzzy in my brain)..hopefully Ben doesn't get halfway down on one knee, reach for the box, do a double take and say, "Wait, no, not the right girl...I just figured it out." I remember how bad it was that Ash may have been intimate with Ben in the Fantasy suite and it made JP so uncomfortable at the AFTR and on their talk show tour...this has the potential to be ugly. Even if Ben did tell Lauren he was in love with Jojo, too, but he could let Jojo go if that meant he got to spend the rest of his life with Lauren...it still will be awful to watch it back for her. I hope Lauren just fastforwards from her FD to the proposal. Just make Jojo ff herself out of the picture. I'm sure Ben is not in love with Jo anymore if still with Lauren. He stops loving Jojo when his real life love for Lauren (post show) just takes off. I could totally see Lauren say that it was okay that Ben was in love with two women and told them because how could you not on a show like this. Ben and I have worked it out, we communicate well, and I totally trust him not to fall in love with anyone else ever again beside me! She'd be cute like that. Even though, in Ben's mind, Jojo's also cute. Haha, there I go again. I have to go to bed. I really wish it was finale night. I'm ready for this season to be over!!!! Maybe Becca for B'ette. I think Caila is too soon if Fleiss said "A matter of hours".

I don't see Lauren crying like that in an interview and then also being let go. I loved both girls FRC dresses!! I thought Jojo's looked like a wedding dress. Lauren's seemed very understated. I'm a huge Lauren fan, could you tell? I don't have anything against Jojo.

Sprite wrote:

nutty1 wrote:So am I the only one who thinks he slept with all 3 of them?

Also, those who mentioned producer manipulation, in what way? Do you think they coerced him to say ILY that many times to both of them? I am really curious to know your thoughts.

Personally, I don't think he slept with all three. Two tops.

JMO...They manipulated him by making him doubt that Lauren cared about him by telling him she hasn't told you she loves you and they told her not to tell him. They also made her date last just to make sure. Then they made him to a whole lot of voiceovers after the fact that would emphasise his telling both of them so that the audience would be beaten over the head with it...just in case we didn't get it.

That doesn't explain the ILY's on their LCD's.

Kelly Travis ‏@kellytravisty
Do you think Olivia is somewhere watching Ben say I love you to two girls and stuck looking like this? #TheBachelor

Ben is a youngnion so ess ok for him to think he loved 2 women. Let's see what happens 6 months down the line with his F1 especially if he does DWTS as speculated, jury is still out for me if these kids know what true love is, JMO.

mizzoufan wrote:So he actually told JoJo first he loved her. Since her date was first

And I guess this is the pickle that he is in. Especially since he knew he was in love with Lauren for a while, why tell JoJo if he didn't sincerely believe the same?